32 acp defense loads

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  • Last Post 22 October 2016
DBW posted this 24 April 2016

I have a Walther PP 32 acp that I would like to use as a dress carry and would like to know if anyone has worked up a good defense load that is reliable and effective for what it is. I would like to use a readily available bullet mold and powder. Would like alloy and any other info.....DBW

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Ed Harris posted this 24 April 2016

Accurate 31-087T cast 1:30 tin/lead, sized .311", RWS or Fiocchi brass of average weight 40 grains, Federal 200 primer, RCBS Little Dandy Rotor #7 to meter 5.6 grains Alliant #2400, which is a full case with slight compression, seat to ctg. OAL 0.95-0.96” and roll crimp.

With 87-grain solid bullet velocity is 900 fps from Walther PP, when bullet is hollow-pointed by Erik at http://www.hollowpointmold.com>http://www.hollowpointmold.com to 82 grains velocity is 940 fps.

For practice load use 2 grains of Bullseye or Red Dot for 830 fps, or 2.5 grains of Unique for 850 fps. For other powders consult Lyman Cast Bullet Handbook 4th Edition (2010) and use data listed on p.237 for Ideal #313249.

73 de KE4SKY In Home Mix We Trust From the Home of Ed's Red in "Almost Heaven" West Virginia

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R. Dupraz posted this 24 April 2016

Reloads for practice --- Factory for carry.

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RicinYakima posted this 24 April 2016

I am using the RCBS 32 CM bullet for practice with 2.2 grains of WW231. (This is not a good load for the Kel-Tec's by the way, nor any other bullet heavier than 75 grains. It is not a pressure issue, but ejection cycle is out of sync.)

The hottest factory load is the FIOCCHI 7,65 Browning 73 grain load made in Italy, not the 71 grain made in Mexico.

FWIW: None of the common HP's will reliably expand from a 4 inch Savage when shot through a denim shirt, tee shirt and empty leather wallet. These are wrapped around an empty milk jug, backed by full ones.

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Brodie posted this 25 April 2016

Ric, I would not worry about expansion from a 32ACP.  I would not even try for it.  My approach would be the same as hunting dangerous game with solids.  Use the heaviest bullet with the largest meplat that will reliably feed in and cycle the weapon ( also the heaviest load I can safely get away with--both for the gun and myself).  I would then practice until I could quickly and reliably place my shots and hope to all heck that there was a good back stop available behind my opponent.  In other words do just what I am doing now with my 22WMR.  Brodie

B.E.Brickey

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RicinYakima posted this 25 April 2016

Brode, I am too fat for fisticuffs; too old to run. If I show them the pistol and they don't leave; it is putting bullets their way to get to the truck for a rifle. AP '06's will solve most of your problems. Ric

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Brodie posted this 25 April 2016

I'm like you Ric.  I don't believe in fisticuffs, but I'll beat the heck out of em with my cane, and a 32acp is better than a hand full of air.  For that matter a 22rf. is better than nothing. 

I was hit by shotgun pellets from 70 yds once and am in no hurry to repeat the experience.

I wasn't criticizing your weapon choice just offering my 2 cents worth of advice.  Personally I feel that relying on expansion from handgun bullets is like asking the Easter Bunny for a Christmas present.  Unreliable in its occurrence and amount.  I personally think of them (pistol rounds) as all solids and non expanding.  Brodie

B.E.Brickey

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DBW posted this 25 April 2016

Thanks Ed, I will give this a try.Will be a little while to get to the range, because of other commitments........DBW

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DBW posted this 25 April 2016

Understood Old Coot. I was exposed to the Walther PP in 32 acp when on the unit rifle team in Mainz Ger. The local police used them and I had several conversations with several as they used the pistol range for training for also. They were much better with them as a whole than the MP units that practiced there also. I see it as the next step up from the 22 wmr though I would not want to bet on the outcome between the two in real situations, the main advantage I see is the 32 is reloadable and I got a really good deal on it some time ago from a widow.......DBW

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DBW posted this 25 April 2016

Rick ,appreciate the info. We are on the same page.........DBW

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45 2.1 posted this 25 April 2016

You might try the MP 32 ACP mold..... It lets you cast an unlimited supply of ~75 gr. hollow points or solids. Loaded with Red Dot to European standards in the PP, it will be quite effective.

Accurate 31-087T cast 1:30 tin/lead, sized .311". Nothing wrong with Ed's bullet or alloy/size. The old blunt solid versus hollow point controversy is in effect though. Having shot a lot of small game and varmints with both (out of a PP), I can tell you which gives up the ghost first though. FWIW: None of the common HP's will reliably expand from a 4 inch Savage when shot through a denim shirt, tee shirt and empty leather wallet Loaded to European standards, the MP mold isn't like that, it expands and knocks on the backbone also. I would not worry about expansion from a 32ACP.  I would not even try for it. Unless you try specialty ammo, the regular American loads are mild. Casting and loading your own stuff makes the 32 ACP shine. Remember, you own a German produced pistol and they loaded their ammo to a different standard.

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Ed Harris posted this 26 April 2016

CIP parameters for 7.65 Browning Source:  http://www.cip-bobp.org/homologation/en/tdccpublic?page=1&cartridgetypeid=4

Max. Sample Avg. 1600Bar

PMax X-bar+3Sigma 1840 Bar 

Proof Pressure 2080 Bar

73 de KE4SKY In Home Mix We Trust From the Home of Ed's Red in "Almost Heaven" West Virginia

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Hamish posted this 27 April 2016

45 2.1 wrote: You might try the MP 32 ACP mold..... It lets you cast an unlimited supply of ~75 gr. hollow points or solids. Loaded with Red Dot to European standards in the PP, it will be quite effective. The only problem with that statement is that there are none available for sale on his website, and the chances of their being a new production run are almost as good as getting tickets for Elvis' triumphant return engagement at the Tropicana on the Vegas Strip.

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Ed Harris posted this 27 April 2016

Accurate has several versions of 75-grain flatnose for .32 ACP, of shape similar to the Buffalo Bore loads, with either conventional lube groove or small tumble-lube grooves. You could then have Erik do the HP conversion, but I prefer the heavy bullet, reasonable meplat and guaranteed deep penetration. The 31-087T flattened blunt nose is a more reliable feeder in guns which run hardball, but don't like the Buffalo Bore Shape.

73 de KE4SKY In Home Mix We Trust From the Home of Ed's Red in "Almost Heaven" West Virginia

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45 2.1 posted this 27 April 2016

TheAmishGolfballShooter wrote: The only problem with that statement is that there are none available for sale on his website, and the chances of their being a new production run are almost as good as getting tickets for Elvis' triumphant return engagement at the Tropicana on the Vegas Strip.

The last list I have from him has two 4 cavity 32 ACP molds left on it. You have to PM him or e-mail a request. There have been two runs so far...................

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Eutectic posted this 06 May 2016

I carried a Colt 32 1903 for my tour in Vietnam. I wore out (rotted off) one holster. I could have sold it for big bucks. You could buy a 45 for 10$ and I was offered 100$ for the little Colt. Why? You could HIDE it! The stupid rules had us unarmed when in town. This was BS in a war zone, I was NEVER unarmed, and this proved a lifesaver. I did not sell it because my Dad wanted it back, he carried it in the Pacific in WWII. I inherited it and owned 2 other 32's, I did a lot of work with 32 ammo. I only loaded cast for practice and bought those. I shot a lot of buckshot with 2 grains of Bullseye - they will even feed most of the time. I tried all the commercial HP ammo I could find.  Some did not feed, an instant rejection. Many refused to expand, and when they did penetration was too shallow for my taste. Velocity was all over the map, use a chronograph, claimed factory velocity is frequently fiction. Sivertip's fed 100% and expanded but you might not like the penetration. In my opinion the 25, 32 and 380 are too underpowered  to benefit from a expanding bullet. I think Ed Harris is correct - get as blunt a bullet as will feed reliably and push it as hard as you can. Steve  

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Ed Harris posted this 06 May 2016

R. Dupraz wrote: Reloads for practice --- Factory for carry. Only factory loads I would carry are the RWS, Sellier & Bellot or Fiocchi 73-grain FMJ which produce 900 fps from a Beretta Tomcat with 2.4” barrel and approach 1000 fps from a Walther PP with 3.9” barrel.  This link shows what Euro hardball does when shot into gelatin:

http://mousegunaddict.blogspot.com/2012/11/clear-gel-terminal-testing-sellier.html>http://mousegunaddict.blogspot.com/2012/11/clear-gel-terminal-testing-sellier.html

Chronograph results 5-shot strings of various .32 ACP FMJs, from Beretta Model 3032 INOX with 2.4” barrel:

R-P 71 FMJ 785 fps W-W 71 FMJ 847 fps Magtech 71 FMJ 806 fps Fiocchi 73 FMJ 845 fps RWS 73 FMJ 959 fps Sellier& Bellot 73 FMJ 938 fps Norma 73 FMJ 894 fps Geco WW2 steel cased 73 FMJ 907 fps Handload, Magtech 71 FMJ, 2.5 Bullseye 910 fps.

The 75-grain Buffalo Bore penetrates a full inch of denim and it still plows though a 14.5” SIM-TEST block before escaping out the side of the block.  This performance is typical for a 75-grain hard cast FN at a bit over 900 fps.- See more at: http://mousegunaddict.blogspot.com/2012/06/buffalo-bore-32-acp-75-grain-hcfn.html#sthash.6gadDNL7.dpuf>http://mousegunaddict.blogspot.com/2012/06/buffalo-bore-32-acp-75-grain-hcfn.html#sthash.6gadDNL7.dpuf    However, the overall cartridge length of the Buffalo Bore load is only 0.715” and it will not feed reliably from most WW2-era pistols which were designed for hardball.  Rim lock can be a problem with short rounds in .32 ACP, which made the Buffalo Bore a non-starter for me. A heavier flatnosed bullet of shape similar to the Buffalo Bore, having a longer nose to provide overall cartridge length of not less than 0.94” in .32 ACP would have possibilities.

UPDATE:  THAT bullet now exists as the Accurate 31-090B

Left to right:

WW2-era 73-grain WRA hardball 75-grain Buffalo Bore FN, which fails to feed in my M1903 Colt! Accurate 31-090B, undergoing testing, has promise Accurate 31-087T, MOST RELIABLE FEEDING HEAVY .32 ACP BULLET IS WELL PROVEN! 

73 de KE4SKY In Home Mix We Trust From the Home of Ed's Red in "Almost Heaven" West Virginia

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DBW posted this 07 May 2016

Ed, thanks for the new info. I have a box of ww 71 gr. which I got two malfunctions out of  about thirty and a box and a half of the fiochi 73 gr. which gave me no malfunctions. Checked accurate website which told me out of stock on the 31-087t. Still think that sounds like what I want. So still looking for an available mold..........DBW

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Ed Harris posted this 07 May 2016

Turnaround on made to order at Accurate is about 4 weeks. If you want the 31-087T you should go ahead and order one.

73 de KE4SKY In Home Mix We Trust From the Home of Ed's Red in "Almost Heaven" West Virginia

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358156hp posted this 08 May 2016

Accurate moulds are made to order, and to your specifications.

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6thtexas posted this 08 May 2016

Ed's load is a great one. if I hadn't already had a 77 FP Accurate mold, I would have bought that design.. BTW the Accurate 77 gr. FP with 5.9 grains of 2400, loaded to .945” works great in my Beretta Tomcat and will do about 913 fps out of that gun. 2.2 grains of Bullseye with the same bullets will run about 830 fps and the brass is easier to find!

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