Colt New Service

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  • Last Post 13 December 2012
45ACPete posted this 03 November 2012

I bought this NS recently--it's a commercial model in pretty good condition considering it must have spent a good part of its life in a holster. The bluing is gone in the usual places and the grips are pretty worn. But, it's tight and the bore and chambers are pristine. The stamping on the barrel says “45 Colt". Turns out the chambering is .45 ACP- which I didn't catch on inspection. No real problem for me as correspondence with some Colt aficionados on the Colt Forum assure me that this was not unusual for some of these guns in a range of serial numbers (which includes mine) and some also had hand checkered backstraps (again, my gun included). Anyway, the gun shoots tight groups at 50ft with some ammo left over from my bullseye days--an H&G 165g SWC and 3.5 g Bullseye. At 25 yds though, not so great. So, I cast some 200g bullets from a SAECO mold which are clones of the H&G 68. Before I load any I try the Ed Harris push-thru test and the unsized bullets just fall through the chambers. So, I cast some bullets of 50/50 WW/pure lead from my Lyman 454190 mold and they are a tight push-thru fit but before loading any I try measuring the barrel and with my caliper at the muzzle the largest dimension I get is .451. So, it appears that I have a gun with .45ACP-length chambers that measure .454 and a barrel diameter of .451. Could I safely shoot the big 45 Colt bullets unsized--or size them down a thou or two--or load the SAECO 200's (cast of my soft 50/50 mix) and see if they “slug up” enough for accuracy at 25-50 yds?I have both 45ACP brass (with full moon clips) and some 45AR brass which I just bought.

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Dale53 posted this 04 November 2012

Ed Harris has experience with the New Service, perhaps he'll jump in here.

In my modern Smith 625's I wouldn't hesitate to shoot the 454190's unsized (if they fit as yours do). From my old memories, I believe that the New Serice is a relatively strong handgun. If an appropriate load of, say, Unique (6.0grs or so) were used I believe that you'll get good rusults with safety. Whether they'll shoot to point of aim or not is another thing. Try it and see.

FWIW Dale53

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Ed Harris posted this 04 November 2012

The. 454-.455 bullets will shoot wonderfully in your .45 ACP Colt New Service with .451 groove diameter. I am just a wee bit envious!!

Dale is correct with hid load reccomendation. A charge of 4.2-4.5 grs. og Bullseye also works well with #454190 and similar. The bulk Remington 255 conicals also shoot well.

73 de KE4SKY In Home Mix We Trust From the Home of Ed's Red in "Almost Heaven" West Virginia

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cptuap posted this 04 November 2012

Would this apply to a model 1917 Colt also? I have a 1917 that does fair with 230gr lead sized to .452 pushed by 6gr of Unique. Might the .454 sizing do better? Charlie

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Ed Harris posted this 04 November 2012

Would apply to the M1917 also.
Check your cylinder throats with plug gages or a sized bullet which you have measured with a micrometer. Throats of .454-.455 in an M1917 Colt or S&W are not unusual. My S&W .45 ACP Hand Ejector has throats of .455, same as my Colt NS.

73 de KE4SKY In Home Mix We Trust From the Home of Ed's Red in "Almost Heaven" West Virginia

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45ACPete posted this 05 November 2012

Thanks, Ed--and Dale. That is welcome news. I'll load some of the big bullets pronto! Pete

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45ACPete posted this 05 November 2012

Thanks, Ed--and Dale. That is welcome news. I'll load some of the big bullets pronto! Pete

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45ACPete posted this 05 November 2012

Thanks, Ed--and Dale. That is welcome news. I'll load some of the big bullets pronto! Pete

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45ACPete posted this 10 December 2012

I've had a couple of sessions shooting the NS with the 454190's and a load of 3.7g Bullseye. It is accurate when my two hand hold is very firm and consistent. But, that big bullet does make for a pretty healthy recoil. Now I have to hold nearly a foot under the bull for center hits at 50 ft. Also, my middle finger gets rapped pretty good. I know that this should be considered a mild load--it's about the same charge I shot one handed in my competition heyday, but I've got to tone it down somewhat. Anybody know if the Tyler adapter was ever made for the New Service? If so, any ideas on locating one? Thanks, Pete

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RicinYakima posted this 10 December 2012

Yes, the adapter was made for many years after the NS went out of production. The main sales were for Colt M1917's. But they are very hard to find now. If you get offered two, I am also looking for one! Ric

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tturner53 posted this 10 December 2012

Maybe a good shooting glove in the meantime?

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Chargar posted this 10 December 2012

I have been a Colt New Service fan since the early 60's when they could be had for $50.00 and less with the military 1917s going for $25-$30. At one time I had four of them in 45 Colt.

I am now down to one good 1917 (45 ACP) and another commercial (1921 vintage) in 45 Colt.

The barrel groove diameter has run a uniform .452 in all of the 1917s and New Services I have in my records (8).

I didn't measure cylinder throats years ago, but on the two I have today, the 1917 runs .456-.4565 and the New Service (45 Colt) runs a uniform .457.

Throughout the years I have mostly used Keiths old 454424 sized .454 over 8 to 8.5 grains of Unique and got all of the accuracy I can use.

I have always had grip adapters on my Colts and have the Pachmayer version.

About 12 years ago I bought a box of 60 Pachmayer grip adapters mostly for the Colt OP and New Service. The Border Patrol used to issue both of those sixguns, and these adapters were left over new stock when they moved their academy from my part of the world many years ago. I sold most of them for $3.00 apiece. I still have a few, but they are personal stash and not for sale..period.

The New Service is one of my favorite sixguns of all times.

Now into my 50th year of casting and reloading for these and other sixguns leaves me shaking my heads at the current thinking on the subject. Folks think they just must have rock hard bullets sized to exact throat diamter to have nay level of accuracy at all. It makes me wonder how previous generations hit anything at all with their sixguns.

In a 44 or 45 sixgun a soft cast bullet will slug up .003 to fill the throats and give good accuracy. That is just the way it is, but you can't tell that to the younger water droping crowd and be belived. Pity!

Much of this is due to folks whose only concern are itty bitty bench rest groups at ranges beyond what most handguns were designed for, particularily those made before WWII. I will guarantee you can kill a deer at 75 to 100 yards with a New Service loaded as above. They will also take care of any social needs at closer ranges. Did I mention, I like these handguns!

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Ed Harris posted this 10 December 2012

Very nice summary Chargar, I couldn't have said it better. I was lucky enough to get a couple of the new old stock Pachmayr adapters from an old postal inspector, it seems they had few Colt M1917s mixed in with their S&Ws too up until the late 1950s.

I love the gun.

By the way, Tyler will make for you on Special Order a T-grip for the New Service, they will do them for the old pre-WWII Police Positive frame too.

73 de KE4SKY In Home Mix We Trust From the Home of Ed's Red in "Almost Heaven" West Virginia

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45ACPete posted this 12 December 2012

Wow--thanks Ed, for the heads-up on the t-grip. I found Tyler and printed an order form for a T-grip for the New Service. It's a size #6 and the price is $25 plus $6.75 S & H. Hear that, Ric? My order will go out tomorrow.

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RicinYakima posted this 12 December 2012

Yep, mine's on the way also.

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Grant posted this 13 December 2012

All problems solved by using the RCBS 45-225-CAV in my 1917 Colt Army with a band outside the case as-cast-diameter.

 

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