Splotches or Blemishes on bullets casted with WW alloy

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  • Last Post 23 January 2015
jeffalfrd posted this 25 October 2014

im new to the forum just joined today and i am also a new CBA member just to introduce myself to the forum.  But anyway on to my question.  I have been casting for a little over a year now and have gotten pretty good at it.  But the only problem i am having is when i use WW alloy i seem to be getting little splotches or blemishes on my bullets.  Now i know that these probably wont hurt anything but they look ugly and im very curious as to why i only get these when i use my WW alloy and not the other alloys i make, like 50/50 lino and pure. and lyman #2 and so on. im trying to keep this as short as possible but wanna give good info so hopefully some of the experts on here can help a rookie out.  i have fluxed with anything and everything that makes carbon when it burns i.e. wax, saw dust, grease, etc. you name it ive use it most likely,  i have used frankford arsenal clean cast flux. i have tried almost everything i guess. first i thought it was a mold problem and maybe it is maybe its got something to do with the casting temp of that particular alloy i dont know but all i know is it happens in all my molds with that alloy and i have 12 different molds of various calibers. some are lyman and some are lee.  but when i use the lino/pure or lyman #2 i dont have that problem.  i always smoke my molds (both lyman and lee) so i tried not smoking and then they had wrinkles and the splotches.  LOL !!!!!  i also tried using frankford arsenal mold release and with that i couldnt really tell cause the mold release made the bullet kinda rough anyway so i didnt like the mold release to well.  but anyway being this is my first post hope i didnt make it too long and hope i gave enough info.  but thanks so much for taking the time to read my post and hope to hear from someone soon.   

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RicinYakima posted this 25 October 2014

I see two issues: one is that there is dirt in the alloy, you are not fluxing enough or with enough waxy material, second the blemish on the side appears to be either oxidized tin or crystalizing antimony.   Clean your lead pot, as a clean pot is a happy pot.   Ric

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onondaga posted this 25 October 2014

http://castbulletassoc.org/view_user.php?id=8433>jeffalfrd

Clean molds that have smoke or mold release products put on them will leave carbon like you have. Just clean alone is fine, but lube as needed . I use clear Silicone dielectric grease on guide areas and pivot points and very judiciously on cutter plate bottom.

Your fluxing may be at fault too.  If metal is not hot enough to cause flux to flame you need more heat during fluxing. but temp also needs to then be lowered for casting. The crystal formation on your bullets is Antimony that migrates to the surface when temperature is too high and then cools too rapidly.

If your fluxing temp had been higher, less skimming would have done a better job.

Gary

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jeffalfrd posted this 25 October 2014

thanks so much for the info, unfortunatley i had to work so long i wont have time to try till tomorrow but i will definatley take all the info that yall have given me and put it to good use what yall are saying makes alot of sense. i knew it had to be something that i was doing wrong with the alloy somehow. just couldnt decide which way to go. hopefully it works cause one of the reasons im trying to get the alloy to work properly is i have a friend who gave me a bunch of wheel weights and now i have almost 200 pounds of ingots from wheel weights that i just couldnt get to act right. as you could imagine it was starting to get a little frustrating, considering 70 percent of the wheel weights were zinc,steel, or iron etc. and it took me a long time to go thru them. thanks for the help again. anything i could do to help let me know ill let yall know how they turn out this time. ttyl

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onondaga posted this 26 October 2014

fluxing temp should be high enough to fire flux and turn carbon into ash so all that is left to skim off is ash and dross fine dust plus floating debris that will not burn. If you have black carbon in bullets like in your picture, fluxing was too cool and incomplete.

Gary

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Mike H posted this 26 October 2014

onondaga wrote: fluxing temp should be high enough to fire flux and turn carbon into ash so all that is left to skim off is ash and dross fine dust plus floating debris that will not burn. If you have black carbon in bullets like in your picture, fluxing was too cool and incomplete.

Gary Gary      When I read your reply,I could see my pot before me,exactly as you described.You have a gift with the ability to describe casting situations.Mike.

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onondaga posted this 26 October 2014

Thanks Mike, Glad I could help!

Gary, Retired Casting Analyst (yes, true, not joke)

An easy way to check if your pot is hot enough for fluxing is to make a tightly wound newspaper wand about 1” in diameter. Touch it to the top of your melt, and if it immediately bursts into flame, your pot of bullet alloy is hot enough to flux properly. For casting WW alloy, you will have to lower temp to about 620 and drop bullets 3 times a minute to maintain working temperature of your mold. Subsequent fluxing can then be done at 620-650 till the pot is done, but start a new potful hot enough to fire the first fluxing.

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jeffalfrd posted this 27 October 2014

okay well i finally found the time to clean my mold, actually i cleaned all of them took me like three hours,  i am picky about some things, lol.  i took everything into consideration and i just got thru fluxin my pot on a high temp. the melt actually look really really good.  im waiting now on the temp to go down to the temp you suggested.hopefully here in just a little bit ill have some good results (fingers crossed)  the only reason i even smoked my molds for one is that is what it said in the directions, and i have heard from alot of people that smoking is not needed.  the only thing is i have never had much luck on casting bullets without smoking but i think with the advice ive been given i think im about to get the hang of it.  i hope cause i always clean my molds before every casting session and most times its a pain to get them clean after they have all that carbon smoke on them if i can get good results without smoking i will be so happy, cause cleaning will be alot easier from now on.  alright should get back with yall soon

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coffeeguy2 posted this 23 January 2015

I wonder, since you're using WW alloy there, if you might have a little bit of zinc contamination too. The driving bands look a little rounded at the edges...Do you notice anything in your pot that looks like silvery oatmeal/sawdust, that never seems to flux back into the alloy?

It won't hurt to shoot those bullets, but you'll notice slight problems with proper fill-out and blemishes til the zinc is gone. Hopefully the rest of your ingots are in good shape, again, no need to throw them out, you'll just need to invest a little more time into sorting your wheelweights if you're smelting them yourself.

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vmwilson posted this 23 January 2015

onondaga wrote: Thanks Mike, Glad I could help!

Gary, Retired Casting Analyst (yes, true, not joke)

An easy way to check if your pot is hot enough for fluxing is to make a tightly wound newspaper wand about 1” in diameter. Touch it to the top of your melt, and if it immediately bursts into flame, your pot of bullet alloy is hot enough to flux properly. For casting WW alloy, you will have to lower temp to about 620 and drop bullets 3 times a minute to maintain working temperature of your mold. Subsequent fluxing can then be done at 620-650 till the pot is done, but start a new potful hot enough to fire the first fluxing. Being I'm thinking you have a PID and a thermometer just what temperature are you going for here?  I have both items available and just curious.

Mike

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Ed Harris posted this 23 January 2015

Coffeeguy is right. You are picking up zinc contamination when bulk melting your wheelweights. I also had this problem until I started carefully regulating the melt temperature not to exceed 740 degrees F. This prevents oxidizing off any tin which may be in your salvage, and is below the melting point of zinc Ww so they may be skimmed off the top and discarded.

Flux well and oftem, and use a thermometer!

73 de KE4SKY In Home Mix We Trust From the Home of Ed's Red in "Almost Heaven" West Virginia

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Ed Harris posted this 23 January 2015

Coffeeguy is right. You are picking up zinc contamination when bulk melting your wheelweights. I also had this problem until I started carefully regulating the melt temperature not to exceed 740 degrees F. This prevents oxidizing off any tin which may be in your salvage, and is below the melting point of zinc Ww so they may be skimmed off the top and discarded.

Flux well and oftem, and use a thermometer!

73 de KE4SKY In Home Mix We Trust From the Home of Ed's Red in "Almost Heaven" West Virginia

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