Winchester 94 Rifle .30 WCF

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Last Post 14 April 2026
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davemarkowitz posted this 06 February 2026

Last week I got this 1935-vintage Winchester 94 rifle in .30 WCF (.30-30). Mechanically the gun is perfect and the bore and crown are in great shape. When I did the transfer at my FFL I also bought 2 boxes of Remington 170 grain Core Lokts so that I'd have some loaded ammo.

I slugged the bore and it mic'ed .30805".

I also acquired a set of dies, Starline brass, a box of Hornady 170 grain Interlock JSPs, some powder coated 178 grain bullets cast in No.2 alloy in a Lee mould from MOD Outfitters, and have a pound of IMR-3031 and well as most of a pound of Reloder 7.

I'm hoping to take this out deer hunting in Tioga County, PA next Fall. Obviously, the Remington factory loads will work just dandy for this but I'd also like to develop a cast bullet load suitable for deer hunting.

For those of you who've hunted whitetail deer with a .30-30 rifle with cast bullets, what mold and alloy do you like?

Also, my bullet casting experience is limited to handguns and muzzeloader bullets. I like tumble lubing handgun bullets using Lee Liquid Alox. Is LLA suitable for velocities in the 1800 - 2000 FPS range or do I need to use something else?

TIA.

--- Dave Markowitz

.30-30

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Wilderness posted this 06 February 2026

Dave - that's a lovely looking rifle - straight out of my 1933 Winchester catalog.

I can't help you with deer, though I've shot a lot of pigs with cast bullets in .30-30, and have come to prefer my cast bullets over jacketed. See "Hunting with Cast Bullets" for specifics. Deer may be less demanding than pigs (???).

Bullets can be cast with a hollow or the hollow can be drilled with the Forster Hollow Pointing Tool.

I use 175 gn hollow point bullets about 16 BHN, slightly harder than #2. Hollows are tapered, beginning at .115", depth .500", removing 10 gns of bullet weight. Velocity in Savage 99 with 24" barrel is 2200 fps. For hollow point bullets, whose noses turn to shrapnel at this velocity, it is important to have enough solid bullet behind the hollow to keep on penetrating - and these bases do penetrate a long way, usually right through the pig.

If I was starting again I would go with the RCBS 180 gn FN bullet, mainly to get the extra weight for HP performance. Then of course you have to hollow point the mould or the bullet. Word is that the RCBS bullet is usually a bit heavier than 180 gns.

Opinions differ on alloys - soft for expansion without a hollow, versus hard with 10 gn hollow. When I tested this against pigs I found that some hollow, about 6 gns, was still needed with the soft alloy - again see "Hunting with Cast Bullets". You may find it easier keeping the group together at velocity with a harder alloy, though I was pleasantly surprised at how well the soft bullets shot with LeveRevolution powder.

I have used slower powders for the full power cast bullet loads - 2208/Varget, 748 and LeveRevolution. The latter gets the speed with least pressure but has to be loaded full on to burn properly, and evidently does best with the heavier bullets. Larry Gibson has done the heavy lifting on LeveRevolution, and had excellent results with Lyman #311041 and the RCBS bullet. See posts 45 to 50.

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?115657-LeveRevoltuion-Powder&highlight=LeveRevolution

With LeveRevolution I have driven my 175 gn cast bullets to 2300 fps without losing the group, but am happy with 2200. This is in the Savage 99. You might settle for a little less in that nice old 94.

As regards bullet lube, I have no experience with LLA at the higher velocity.

You are only as good as your library.

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Aaron posted this 06 February 2026

Sweet looking rifle! My hunting and "go to" load for my Winchester M94 is the Lee 309-170-F cast in Lyman #2 and pushed with 30.0gr of IMR-3031. I use Whites 50/50 lube.

Chronograph at 2019 fps with a SD of 2 fps and a range of 4 fps. Yup....single digits. I have no experience with the Lee tumble lube. I do not believe it is a viable lube for 2000fps and you need a Lee tumble lube capable bullet for it. It might work fine for a 38 special, but the 30-30 is another league.

The Lee bullet and load mentioned above works in my M94 and my T/C Contender. The bullet nose on that Lee bullet is a bore riding nose and you may find that is a crucial thing when looking at other bullet molds. ALL of my other 30 caliber (30-30) molds will not work in the M94 unless the bullets are deep seated due to the short freebore of the Winchester rifles.

KISS

With rifle in hand, I confidently go forth into the darkness.

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Aaron posted this 06 February 2026

Wilderness has done a lot of work with his 30-30 hard cast bullets and that work bears reading. It's all posted on the forum and it's a great way to spend a cold evening doing something besides shoveling snow or cleaning gutters if you live in Florida.

It would be wonderful if you are not a member of the CBA, to consider becoming a member. That helps keep this forum online and answering questions like you posted. The forum is also a fantastic repository of data and information that would be a terrible loss if we lose membership funds. Give it a thought will you?

With rifle in hand, I confidently go forth into the darkness.

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beemer posted this 06 February 2026

The RCBS 180 FN that I use poured with WW, lubed with GC is 200 grains. Shoots well in my Marlin but the nose is a little large. I load for paper punching so no hunting loads.

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lotech posted this 06 February 2026

The 180 RCBS GC flat nose at 190 grains is quite accurate in a .30-30 and most other .30 caliber rifles. A good cast bullet for deer hunting if you give it enough velocity and don't cast it too hard. I prefer this bullet over the #311290 and the #311041; better weight and accuracy.

I haven't had a .30-30 in years; had two '94s for a long time; lost all interest in them eventually and sold them. The first cast bullet I used in .30-30 was the Lee 170 gr. As I recall, it was the most accurate .30-30 bullet I ever tried, just not heavy enough for me so I went with the RCBS 180.

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davemarkowitz posted this 07 February 2026

Welp, I have another .30-30 to load for. I went to the Oaks, PA gun show today and a Stevens 325B followed me home. Overall it's in excellent condition with a great bore and crown. I setup a search on eBay for an original Savage-Stevens peep sight, for which it's drilled and tapped. It's not D&T for a scope. Another option would be adding a short section of Picatinny rail on the receiver ring and then mounting something like a Holosun micro-red dot sight on it. (I like the Holosun dots because they give me a crisp reticle even with my astigmatism.

I slugged the bore with a .32 caliber pistol bullet.

I ordered a couple spare magazines for it from Numrich. The sling is a Chicom SKS sling that I bought at the gun show.

I'm looking forward to trying this with cast bullets.

--- Dave Markowitz

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davemarkowitz posted this 17 February 2026

I put together a box of plinking rounds today using some 1990s-vintage 154 grain Alberts Scheutzen Plinker bullets over 9.0 grains of Unique. I figure they'll do around 1200 - 1300 FPS from the Stevens. My late father had the bullets in his stash and I got them when my brother and split up his things a couple years ago.

They should be fun for paper punching and banging the gong at my club.

--- Dave Markowitz

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shootcast posted this 18 February 2026

30-30 WCF

I believe you can find the third edition Lyman handbook on line to read. Excellent article on hunting by C.E.Harris and Dennis Marshall. The Lyman 311041 was designed for the 30-30. Its wide met plate will provide good penetration and expansion for hunting. Read the article you won’t go wrong. I have harvested most of my deer with a 30-30. Most of them with cast bullets. I’m a woods hunter mainly. The 041 should cycle in your rifle. The RCBS 180 FP may not. I have used both in my TC carbine. The 180 I had to taper the nose section to extract from chamber. You shouldn’t have that problem with the Lyman 041. Cast from w/wts. & Lead at a 50-50 mix it will weigh about 175 grains. This is soft enough to give extra expansion over harder alloys. I started with IMR 3031 powder and never seen a need to switch. Lyman data list a max load at 27 grains. I’m sure you will find a load your rifle likes. I used the 041 this season but loaded in the 7.62x39. Same powder 3031 . Muzzle velocity about 1850 fps. Picture and small article on forum. Deer Season.

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Qc Pistolero posted this 08 March 2026

Like Shootcast,I started using 3031 for my 30-30 in the late '70s.Never felt the need to try something else for full power loads.

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Eddie Southgate posted this 20 March 2026

Dave,

There are several Savage 340 sights on ebay right at the moment , they are high but available . Make sure you get a complete one as there are a couple on there that are missing parts.

Grumpy Old Man With A Gun......Do Not Touch .

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davemarkowitz posted this 20 March 2026

Thanks Eddie. I did find an old WFC peep on eBay and got it. I still haven't gotten it to the range yet. Too many irons in the fire.

--- Dave Markowitz

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9.3X62AL posted this 25 March 2026

The 30/30 Winchester might be the single-best cast bullet rifle caliber ever made. Using conventional lube-groove bullet designs like Lyman's #311041 or its many clones, it can be run to the caliber's full potential velocity & accuracy easily. My cast recipe is Lyman #311041 sized at .310" and lubed with Carnauba Red in a Lyman 4500 sizer; 30.0 grains of IMR 3031 OR 31.0 grains of WW-748; WLR primers in W-W cases. Also note that my hunting bullets are cast as 'Bruce B Soft Points' in hopes for some expansion upon contact. Some beta testing on coyotes did show evidence of expansion--1/2" entry wounds and 1.5"-2" exits.

Alas, lead bullets are now verboten for hunting where I live in the People's Republic of Kalifornistan. Condor cuddlers, hoplophobes, and plumbophobes have made lead for hunting as toxic as uranium-238 in this carjacker's theme park. To avoid DFW's wrath I now load the Barnes all copper pretenders for venison harvesting--in 30-06 and 6.5 x 55.

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Aaron posted this 25 March 2026

Heard a customer today at my LGS lamenting to the staff about how bad the 30-30 is for deer hunting. "Won't put the deer down." "Have to track them for hours." "Need a 30-06 or a 308 to really work."

I resisted and kept my mouth shut. I didn't tell him he should practice more to become a more accurate shooter and stop gut shooting the poor critters. What a blow-hard.

I believe the 30-30 has kilt more deer than Ford, GMC, Dodge, and Chevy trucks combined.

With rifle in hand, I confidently go forth into the darkness.

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Wilderness posted this 26 March 2026

A point of interest on .30-30s is rifling twist, and a 12" twist may give the .30-30 the cast bullet edge against .30-06, .30/40, .303 etc. Winchester has 12", Marlin are almost all 10", and the Stevens may have a 10" twist.

Edit: Lyman #44 says Stevens 325 has 12" twist.

My Savage 99 .30-30 has a late production 12" twist barrel and shoots 175 gn cast HP to 2300 fps (LVR powder) with no trumpeting at 200 meters. My Marlin 336A has 10" twist and shoots fine at 50 meters at a bit over 2000 fps, but I have not put it to the test at 200, in part because without a scope the groups could mean anything or nothing (Savage is scoped).

My Ruger 77V (10" twist) was going to be the next step up in in cast bullet power after the .30-30. Same bullet, 40-46 gns 4350 powder, velocity averages 2100 to 2393 fps, groups at 50 meters 1.2" to 1.4".

Then at 100 meters the groups blew out to 4.1" - 4.8" at 2400 fps.

So I'm still shooting things with the Savage 99 and still thinking it must be nearly Tops for .30" cast bullets.

You are only as good as your library.

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Eddie Southgate posted this 29 March 2026

I bought a Arsenal 311-176 LFN , an LBT copy today on Ebay . Anyone used this or Veral's original ? I have two 94's in .30-30 , both post 64 , actually one is a 1964 and the other a 1972. I have used the WFN and LFN bullets in pistol calibers but this is my first in a rifle bullet. Suggestions ?

Grumpy Old Man With A Gun......Do Not Touch .

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Wilderness posted this 29 March 2026

Eddie - for power or gentle accuracy?

A nice accurate load is 17 gns of 2207/H4198 - about 1450 fps.

For power, LeveRevolution is good in the longer barrels but needs to be loaded full throttle - you'll cop some noise and recoil and high shooting in the carbines.

Check out Aaron's results with LVR and the Lee bullet in the thread on Hard Cast HP .30-30 Bullet on a Big Sow - over in the Hunting With Cast Bullets section.

You are only as good as your library.

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Ed Harris posted this 02 April 2026

The .30-30 is one 9th the few cartridges which is actually more effective on game with correct cast bullet loads than with factory jacketed.

The article Dennis Marshall and I did still has good info, but there are better bullet designs available today. Accurate has several which are improvements over #31141.

Accurate 31-171D is my design for full charge loads in .30-30 with 30 grains of 4895, 4064, RL15 or Varget.

73 de KE4SKY In Home Mix We Trust From the Home of Ed's Red in "Almost Heaven" West Virginia

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Eddie Southgate posted this 02 April 2026

Eddie - for power or gentle accuracy?

A nice accurate load is 17 gns of 2207/H4198 - about 1450 fps.

For power, LeveRevolution is good in the longer barrels but needs to be loaded full throttle - you'll cop some noise and recoil and high shooting in the carbines.

Check out Aaron's results with LVR and the Lee bullet in the thread on Hard Cast HP .30-30 Bullet on a Big Sow - over in the Hunting With Cast Bullets section.

A combination of both with not enough power to blow the accuracy. I did read a lot of the stuff y'all posted and it was interesting . Especially sizing the .32 down for the .30-30 and getting better accuracy which runs counter to about anything you read on bullet sizing .I mostly hunt now days so power is important up to the point where it has much effect on accuracy. Most of my shots are under 100 yards . I'm not into the HP bullets in my rifles but have considered a bullet with a cup point . Have tried them in handgun bullets compared to the same bullet with a solid nose and found that they give the perfect amount of expansion with the alloy I prefer to use. Good straight penetration with plenty of expansion is an unbeatable combination. Was just wondering if anyone was using this specific bullet.

As far as recoil and noise , not an issue here . My favorite rifle and the one I shoot the most is a 1936 Winchester model 71 in .348 , but I also shoot a good bit of .325 WSM , .358 Winchester and .45-70 loaded to their potential.

PS : My alloy is 2% SN 2% SB 96% PB , very tough but nowhere near brittle and expands well and is good for handgun and rifle both though I use it more in rifle bullets. It's hard enough without being hard enough to lose the folded portion of the mushroom . I like a bullet to hold together under stress.

Grumpy Old Man With A Gun......Do Not Touch .

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Wilderness posted this 02 April 2026

Eddie - I was pleasantly surprised when I tried soft bullets with LeveRevolution. One group only, so conclusions could change, but 192 gn solid bullet with 31 gns LVR (have used up to 34 gns with lighter and harder HP bullets from the same mould) gave 2100 fps and a five shot group at 100 meters of 2.75". This is just about bang on my average for the HP loads (175 gns x 32 gns x 2200 fps x 17 groups). Bullet weights are with gas check.

I had expected the group to blow out with the softer alloy. The fact that it didn't may be down to the slow pressure rise of LVR relative to other powders - see Larry Gibson's work on LVR. LVR groups WILL blow out if you back them off. Suggest using chronograph and cranking up to 2200 fps - your bullet design and seating depth may require more powder than mine.

My other favorites for .30-30 cast full power have been 748 (33 gns) and 2208/Varget (32 gns). Velocity is a fraction less than for LVR but groups may be better.

You are only as good as your library.

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Eddie Southgate posted this 04 April 2026

This is the bullet , Arsenal LBT clone 311-176 GC LFN . I'm thinking I might send it to Eric to have it fitted with a set of cup point and flat point pins . I don't have LVR and am awfully low on 4198 and RL7 but I do have the Varget and 748 as well as most anything else normally found to be useful in .30-30 and .32 WS so I suspect finding a load will be no problem . Veral's long flat nose series has a good reputation for being good quick killing bullets so I suspect this direct copy will do the same.

Grumpy Old Man With A Gun......Do Not Touch .

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