Mike Venturino does the .45 Scofield in Handloader

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Last Post 09 August 2013

CBA Member

Clod Hopper posted this 30 June 2013

I noticed in the latest Handloader that Mike Venturino did a story on the .45 Scofield. He likes the RCBS 230 grain LFN and among other loads, 4.3 grains of Bullseye. This sounded more than familiar to me, so I looked in TFS 193 May-June 2008 at Ed Harris' article “Cowboy Slugs Convert .45 ACP into a “Smokeless Schofield".

Ed likes the Saeco #954 or RCBS 230-LFN in a .45 ACP converted Pietta 1858 Remington copy. Guess what his most accurate load is? Yep, 4.3 grains of Bullseye. He did go up to 5 grains with this bullet, but settled on 4.5 grains as giving the same velocity as the original Scofield load.

Mike tested a number of other powders, and four other bullets. It's just interesting to me that he came to a very similar conclusion with regular .45 Scofield brass.

Dale M. Lock

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Brodie posted this 30 June 2013

That sounds like Venturino, he stole his unearned nickname from John Wayne, and His mat4erial from T F S. That man sure is a big bag of wind.

B.E.Brickey

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Ed Harris posted this 30 June 2013

And also look at the current issue 223-10:

45 Colt vs. Schofield in the Colt New Service and New Model Blackhawk!

You all saw the “previews” right here on the CBA forum. And THANK YOU ALL for the feedback which helped me improve that article. A GREAT TEAM effort overall. We all claim some ownership there!

Now, you know what? Don't begrudge the poor guy his rice bowl.

I've got a modest, but adequate retirement as a former local government bureaucrat, so I don't need to get paid for articles. I write today for love of the game and to give something back. Sort of carrying the torch handed off by Frank Marshall. It's more of a duty call.

I'm not sure that Mike does all that well by gleaning freebies from the advertisers and doing his best to whore for the firearms industry. I did that for a while after the NRA became advertiser focussed instead of reader focussed, and quickly grew tired of it.

Different strokes for different folks.

Cut the poor guy some slack. He's trying to feed his family. Enjoy reading him for entertainment.

If he comes back to West Virginia for a visit I'll be happy to lubricate him with corn likker and feed him ramps and possum pie with cornbread. He might even remember his roots!

If we might pop a cap together at Peacemaker National Training Center www.peacemakernational.com that would be a bonus!

73 de KE4SKY In Home Mix We Trust From the Home of Ed's Red in "Almost Heaven" West Virginia

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Chargar posted this 30 June 2013

When stuff like this happens,without evidence to the contrary, I assume two guys came to the same conclusion because it was the right conclusion. Two squirrels can find the same nut, if nobody carries it off.

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Ed Harris posted this 30 June 2013

Chargar wrote: When stuff like this happens,without evidence to the contrary, I assume two guys came to the same conclusion because it was the right conclusion. The squirrels can find the same nut, if nobody carries it off.

I like that analogy and agree.

73 de KE4SKY In Home Mix We Trust From the Home of Ed's Red in "Almost Heaven" West Virginia

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Thomas Trevor posted this 30 June 2013

The “Iron Duke” did not steal that nickname from John Wayne ! He named himself after the 1962 Pontiac four cylinder engine of the same name made by cutting a V-8 in half. Guess because it wieghed 500 pounds?

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Brodie posted this 30 June 2013

Thomas I stand corrected, I had only heard him referred to as “the Duke>"

B.E.Brickey

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Webley posted this 01 July 2013

Old Coot wrote: Thomas I stand corrected, I had only heard him referred to as “the Duke>"

Actually, I have heard of him referred to as “Duke", not “the Duke". I know several people locally who go by Duke, so I am good with it.

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stevebarrett posted this 01 July 2013

Amazing what you learn. On this side of the Atlantic the Iron Duke was always the Duke of Wellington (the one who helped do for Napoleon). Now I check Wikipedia though, the term has been used loads of times.

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CBA Member

billglaze posted this 01 July 2013

Purely my Opinion, and worth what you have just paid. I always read the guy, because he is, after all, pretty entertaining. I tend to take what he says with a grain of salt about the size of a 55 gallon drum, but, because I'm skeptical of all these gun scribes, (and I'm frequently correct in my skepticism) they don't manage to do me any harm. And, remember, the editor has a certain number of column/pages to fill each issue. As I say, YMMV Bill

In theory, there's no difference between theory and practice. In practice, there is. My fate is not entirely in Gods hands, if I have a weapon in mine.

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Ed Harris posted this 01 July 2013

billglaze wrote: Purely my Opinion, and worth what you have just paid. I always read the guy, because he is, after all, pretty entertaining. I tend to take what he says with a grain of salt about the size of a 55 gallon drum, but, because I'm skeptical of all these gun scribes, (and I'm frequently correct in my skepticism) they don't manage to do me any harm. And, remember, the editor has a certain number of column/pages to fill each issue. As I say, YMMV Bill

Well stated. I don't always agree with him, but I read most of what Mike writes, AND enjoy it, which is more than I can say for tbe cast majority of what they try to pass off as shooting articles today.

At least he likes old guns and lead bullets and doesn't go into orgazmic tizzy fits with everynew iteration of AR or M1911.

If I never see another article on an AR or M1911, it would suit me just fine!

73 de KE4SKY In Home Mix We Trust From the Home of Ed's Red in "Almost Heaven" West Virginia

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R. Dupraz posted this 01 July 2013

You said it Ed!

And you can add the 9mm as well. While I've had an ongoing love affair with the 19ll since the mid “60's", they have been more than beat to death since then.

R. Dupraz

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JeffinNZ posted this 01 July 2013

Ed Harris wrote: Chargar wrote: When stuff like this happens,without evidence to the contrary, I assume two guys came to the same conclusion because it was the right conclusion. The squirrels can find the same nut, if nobody carries it off.

I like that analogy and agree.

Yeap. I agree.

Cheers from New Zealand

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CBA Member

billglaze posted this 02 July 2013

Agreeing with Ed, here, as well as others. I do, however, dearly love the 1911, and, as I read recently, an author I read a lot considers the 9mm to be a .45 set to “stun.” But, it (the 1911) has been written to death recently, IMHO. I won't ever see an AR-15, any M16 or M4 in my future; I've never been an exponent of the “spray and pray” school, plus the fact that the cartridge It's chambered for isn't even powerful enough to be legal for deer in this (NC) state, and the rifles I've seen at the range couldn't hit a bull in the a** with a bass fiddle. Not to mention the many mods it's been through in an effort to get a piece that will reliably do the job. Tough to beat a well-aimed shot, with an adequate caliber weapon. Above is strictly my opinion, I realize that many probably don't see it my way; but, that's O.K.,it's a free country. (For a while, at least.) Bill

In theory, there's no difference between theory and practice. In practice, there is. My fate is not entirely in Gods hands, if I have a weapon in mine.

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CBA Regional Director

Tom Acheson posted this 03 July 2013

I especially enjoy his BPCR silhouette articles. I have his books on the Colt single action revolver and the buffalo rifles. The buffalo rifles book was really helpful to me when I first got around to loading and shooting my C. Sharps 40-70 SS.

Mike worked hard to improve his shooting to get into Master Class in the NRA silhouette game. He also was a match director at a club in Montana.

That's the risk with putting your thoughts in writing...you are open to criticism. But is the criticism from an intellectual perspective or one of envy? We can always learn something from what we read. As a former musician I was always “stealing” from what I heard and saw others do. As a shooter, I have the same trait, as do many of us, especially those of us who shoot competitively. The day we stop incorporating the selective things we learn from others is the day we dry up and blow away.

Tom

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Chargar posted this 03 July 2013

Tom Acheson wrote:

We can always learn something from what we read. As a former musician I was always “stealing” from what I heard and saw others do. As a shooter, I have the same trait, as do many of us, especially those of us who shoot competitively. The day we stop incorporating the selective things we learn from others is the day we dry up and blow away.

Tom

When you steal from one person that is called “plagiarism", but when you steal from several, that is called “research".

In case this is too subtle for some, it was meant to be humorous, nothing serious about it.

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Chargar posted this 03 July 2013

Tom Acheson wrote:

Tom

When you steal from one person that is called “plagiarism", but when you steal from several, that is called “research".

In case this is too subtle for some, it was meant to be humorous, nothing serious about it.

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Clod Hopper posted this 03 July 2013

I meant no criticism of Mike and do not think he stole anything, it's just interesting to me that he came up with the exact same load in similar brass. Mike has to write for a living and therefore, must follow certain guidelines. Note that he wrote about five different bullets, and four different powders, so that more than one advertiser was mentioned. This is a good thing IMO. If some one noticed a new load or a new idea and went out and bought say Tightgroup, which is a newer powder, that is good. Ed, on the other hand, does not have to please anyone but himself. Suppose he wrote ten articles for Handloader, and only used one powder, the other advertisers would be a little miffed. Ed's intent is to cut down on the number of powders for a number of good reasons covered before, and to come up with one useful load for every similar cartridge in a wide variety of guns. Two different philosophies, both useful, IMO.

Dale M. Lock

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CBA Regional Director

Tom Acheson posted this 03 July 2013

I wasn't being critical of anyone. I just find it odd that way too often we see generalized comments about not so positive things regarding gun writers. I guess nothing is 100%, not our politicians, our guns and loads, our kids teachers, our golf games our cars.....and neither are gun writers. Just an observation.

Tom

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.22-10-45 posted this 03 July 2013

Getting back to the .45 S&W Schofield ctg., A few years ago, I was working with a circa 1980 Colt 1860 army in .44 percussion, which I had installed a Kirst conversion 5 shot cyl. in .45 Colt. Due to the weak open top, 3 piece-held together by a wedge design, I keptpowder charges light. Using Hercules Bullseye, Hodgdon Tightgroup, and IMR TrailBoss, I found the shorter Schofield brass gave better accuracy than the longer .45 Colt. Both versions were Starline brass. Figuring shorter was better due to those light charges, I ordered some .45 Special Cowboy brass..this little case is about 1/2 the length of the Schofield..must have been too much of a good thing..although the bore and cylinder chambers were much cleaner..probably from the reduced case capacity having a more complete burn..accuracy was lousy with all powders..probably due to increased bullet jump.