NEF Handy Rifle

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  • Last Post 29 January 2015
John Alexander posted this 24 January 2015

I have a fat barreled NEF Handy Rifle in 223.  I thought it might be interesting to see what it would do with cast bullets.  To avoid beating a dead horse I tried it with jacketed first to see if there was any promise.  I used a load that works well in my other 223s using Sierrra Match Kings and shot four five shot groups at 100 yards.   Results: Average Group size --  2.47" Average vertical spread -- 2.43" Average horizontal spread -- 0.72"

The .72” is interesting.  Do these rifle usually string their shots vertically?  If so is there a fix?

Any information will be appreciated.  Thanks.

John

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onondaga posted this 25 January 2015

http://castbulletassoc.org/view_user.php?id=6375>John Alexander

I fixed mine that had the same problem. It is time to try my bore polishing method for you.

These barrels string vertically with cast bullets due to their bore finish quality. You can change that.

Here is how I do it:

http://castbulletassoc.org/view_topic.php?id=8364&forum_id=63>http://castbulletassoc.org/viewtopic.php?id=8364&forumid=63

Do not make any substitutions, take short cuts or change the method from the description. Get a helper, this is a strenuous job but only a one time thing to get through.

Clean and dry the BoreSnake when you are done with the polishing job and take it to the range. Pull it through once dry after every 5 shots. This will keep your bore in a relatively constant condition for accuracy. Timing shots at 3 minutes works for me once the full polishing procedure is completed.

Gary

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bandmiller2 posted this 25 January 2015

John, break open rifles sometimes have a tendency to string vertically. I believe its due to the lockup and sometimes cases not sized enough. I rebarreled an old navy line throwing gun to 22 mashburn bee and the results are close to yours. Possibly barrel vibrations are affected buy how the action is closed. Frank C.

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tturner53 posted this 25 January 2015

I've run into that with Handi Rifles. Make sure the lockup parts are dry, no oil. Try to be consistent how you close it. I slam mine shut. Play with the forend screw, tighter, looser. Many people swear by an o-ring or cork spacer around the forend screw stud on the barrel. When shooting off a rest or bags place the support under the front of the action. A little further back than is typical. If all else fails, shoot it minus the forend altogether, see if anything changes. If so, you have a clue where the problem lies. Last, don't give up. Really lay on the gun when shooting, they can squirm around. My older 22” H&R .223 really wants to be an MOA gun, but is not quite. Many are. The slow lock time doesn't help. Did I mention bag hell out of it and lay on it. They squirm. Follow thru. PS I'm looking at Tikas now at Sportsman's Warehouse. Dang it!

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onondaga posted this 25 January 2015

Great tips from http://www.castbulletassoc.org/view_user.php?id=2514>tturner53, I do all those and would add more.

Factory trigger jobs are free for the asking if you send in the rifle for an accessory additional barrel. If you do any smithing of your own, the trigger job on this rifle is easy. Bending a spring is about all you have to do once you get in.

The rifle is light in weight even with a heavy barrel. I cut a piece of copper plumbing tubing to fit the action bolt hole in the butt stock. Fill the copper tube with lead. That adds 2 pounds the rifle needs to be steady. The 2 pounds will even shift the rifle's harmonic center. These rifles are sensitive to having a sling mounted when bench shooting. Take the sling off at the bench. Don't just let the sling hang there. You need to really and consciously use a sling like a trained master or take it off with this rifle at the bench.

If you get coppering when you shoot jacketed bullets, that spells one thing to me. My polishing method is a cure for that annoyance to a great degree. Mediocre bore condition is a result of the Handi-rifle being inexpensive. You can fix that and lower coppering by polishing the bore. Progressive coppering in a mediocre bore building up makes shots string vertically. I have numerous friends/acquaintances that have only tried my polishing method to lower coppering and make their rifles easier to clean. I have had zero negative feedback on coppering and maintenance getting worse after polishing.

Gary

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gpidaho posted this 25 January 2015

As Tim said, the rest should be under the action not forward for best results. I used Garys method of bore conditioning on my 223 Handi and it's as easy to clean as any rifle I own. If I'm shooting PC'd bullets just a patch or two to remove the burned powder dust does it. Thank you for the tip Gary. As always, the biggest detriment to accuracy seems to be ME. Love my Handis. GP

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M. W. Curtess posted this 25 January 2015

OH! BOY! Gary. I really like the  promise of this one! (And just imagine - it actually uses products I already have, or know where to find locally!)  I have a bunch of Handi-Rifles, from 22 Hornet to 45-70 and love 'em all.  But they rarely shoot as good as they “want” to, and this may make all the difference.  I'm an un-reconstructed BPCRS shooter tho, and can't bring myself to rest anything on the forestock (unless the wood goes all the way to the bayonet lug). I reason that this method pretty much takes any issues of forearm attachment or bedding out of the equation, and harmonically has the same advantage that long sightbases (” raduises") have optically and dimensionally, altho we typically mark the barrel at its “sweet spot” to be rested on the front bags or cross sticks, and keep velocities down below 1500.  Better late than never for your polishing system.  I can't count the work hours I've spent “breaking in” my employer's AR's with JB Paste (which I'm not convinced actually accomplished anything) and he's got one or more of every AR they were ever availble in. B-O-R-I-N-G! 

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John Alexander posted this 25 January 2015

Thanks to all for the many suggestions.  I appreciate that you took the time to write.

Unfortunately my 100 yard range just got snowed under and now will require snowshoes for target changing so the Handy will have to wait till spring.  If I have to snowshoe it will be for a little more serious reason.  Back to the tunnel and cast bullets.

John

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Ken Campbell Iowa posted this 26 January 2015

hi john ...first of all, rifles tend to vertically string just because their barrels are attracted to the center of the earth . try shooting your handi-rifle lying on your side. and do take a selfie for us when reporting this new data point. ( g ) .

and in regard to vertical stringing and bore polishing .. one time a buddy was trying out his new sako finnfire ( 22 rf sporter ) ... drat !! 3/4 inch at 50 yards ... drat !! and then we noticed zero horizontal, 3/4 vertical ... hmmm ... scope screws check ... bedding check ....ok, try firelap with 250 grit ...4 shots later it went to roughly zero horizontal, zero vertical ... stop firelapping !! good enough .

rough chamber causing erratic ignition ?

btw, if you find a used finnfire sporter, grab it .. those are magic rifles, kinda like the win. 70 featherweights . and yes, the sporter outshoots the target barrel model ...

also i would try resting the hr on the barrel; the unmodified ruger one rattles when you rest on it's forearm. the win. 85 highwalls just have a lump of wood screwed to the barrel ... works great.

ken

hey !! is it fair to improve a production rifle ??? GOTCHA !!!

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onondaga posted this 26 January 2015

http://www.castbulletassoc.org/view_user.php?id=40>Ken Campbell Iowa

I get the opposite effect of “working great” that you mention when I have tried resting the barrel of my Handi-rifle in .500 S&W Mag on a shooting rest.  3 times I tried that, it was the same 3 times the action popped open on recoil.

 I have read several discussions on Graybeard outdoors forum linking resting the barrel of a Handi-rifle to be the cause of a severe change in barrel whip that opens the action of Handi-rifles on recoil. Oil on the latching areas of the lockup of the Handi will make this even more violent, but the rifle only pops opens after the bullet is gone. It is scary when this happens but was harmless to me 3 times. Personally, when that happened to me, I searched the internet till I found answers. I tried the suggestions of cleaning oil off the latch and resting the rifle on the action and it never popped open again even with heavier loads, But, I would still be hesitant to rest  even a light recoil .223 Handi-rifle barrel on a rest and shoot it. Whipping and slamming the lockup like that is an excess of repetitive stress that I will avoid.

Gary

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Ken Campbell Iowa posted this 26 January 2015

wow gary .. that is amazing and important to know ! i stand dis-connected from my thought on resting the barrel on a rod to shoot it.

wish i had my 30-30 hr back to play with that ... it was fun to shoot 32 acp wadcutters out of. i would take a look at ” locking the lock ” ...kinda a belt-and-suspenders approach.

ken

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M. W. Curtess posted this 26 January 2015

Whaaaaaat?  I count 7 HandiRifles from where I'm sitting, and enough parts & barrels  in the closet to build a couple more (barrels in chamberings I don't regard worth buying bullet moulds for) and have had only one experience of opening when fired. (Scared the dickens out of me!) It was the oldest one , a real H&R “Shikari” on the original malleable iron frame, but recent enough to have that insane “riser” trigger safety - which had issues.  Once I got that all replaced (which was a chore in itself since the company was by then N. E. F. who refused to even TALK about parts for H&R's - altho the guts are identical) I have never had a recurrence.  Something I gott'a ask here, is if your rifles open shooting offhand?  If not, maybe it's time to re-think all the unnatural pressures your bench-techniques are placing on mechanisms that were probably never tested during R&D as “bench-rifles". (Bearing in mind that they were originally Topper  shotguns). On bags, or sticks, I put as little “down” pressure as possible on mine, allowing the weight of the rifles to lay naturally, only pulling them into my shoulder firmly to the rear (limp-wristing a 45-70 with a 520 gr CB is something you're apt to do only once, voluntarily / carelessly!)

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joeb33050 posted this 26 January 2015

Why not just aim a little higher for the low shots, a little lower for the high shots? Properly done, the groups will be much shorter.

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OU812 posted this 27 January 2015

Would the Hunters Hold cure stringing? Grasping forearm with hand while shooting.

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John Alexander posted this 27 January 2015

I didn't know that was what it is called but I sometimes shoot from he bench that way.  i will put that on my list of things to try in the spring when I get back on the NEF project. John

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joeb33050 posted this 27 January 2015

On a more serious note, I borrowed NEF/W&H/H&R rifles from the company, tested them and wrote articles on 30-30, 308 and 45-70 in the 9-0s, for the ASSRA news. To excite interest I blew up the 308.There were then 4 rifles tested, and all 4 shot quite well at the end of a lot of testing and some fire lapping. I don't remember any vertical stringing problem when they were shooting. In the early 70s when in grad school I worked a night job, mechanical inspector, at Merriman Co. in Hingham MA. Merriman made powder metal = sintered parts, including actions for the H&R shotgun and ?Topper? SS rifle. The actions, hammers and other parts started as powder, into a die, squoze, into the furnace and done. We made lots of these actions, racks and racks of them. I wonder if the modern day guns start as powder?

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M. W. Curtess posted this 27 January 2015

Over the years, I have become quite intimate with the inner-workings of my H&R's and successors, and even the newest one (the H&R 1871 Buffalo Classic) the moving parts (if not stamped sheet-metal) definately have that “sintered” look. (I'm not sure it could be polished away?)  As for the frames, I've been led to think they are forgings, just like most suspension parts of cars & trucks are.  But even if beginning with powder, they are certainly strong (and wear-resistant) enough!   (The original H&R frames are obviously softer - for whatever reason?)

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tturner53 posted this 27 January 2015

I've heard the HandiRifles are going the way of the DoDo bird. Discontinued. I called the factory and was told the Accessory Barrel Program is discontinued. Bummer. There was still a couple barrels I wanted, like a 26” .280 Remington and several others. Good news for Rossi and CVA though.

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onondaga posted this 27 January 2015

The H&R 1871 Barrel Accessory Program site lists 57 different barrel styles in stock for SB1 and SB2 actions or H&R and NEF single shot rifles. It lists “limited availability” for the 2 models of 35 Whelen barrels only. Here is the link:

http://www.hr1871.com/Support/accessoryProgram.asp>http://www.hr1871.com/Support/accessoryProgram.asp

I read differently than what http://www.castbulletassoc.org/view_user.php?id=2514>tturner53 says he has heard and sure hope  he is wrong.

Gary

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bandmiller2 posted this 28 January 2015

I have never owned a “handy rifle” but one chambered for 444 marlin or 35 whelen must be like having a tiger by the tail, the ones I've handled weren't that heavy. I'am surprised they chamber them for the Whelen and 30-06. Frank C.

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bandmiller2 posted this 28 January 2015

Joeb33050, Do you know if a powdered metal receiver could be case hardened.?? It might be a way to tell the difference. Most of the break action receivers I have seen appear to be cast. Frank C.

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