.22 CALIBER CAST BULLETS

Because Ill stir a pot and don't really care any more.... I'm going out on a limb.

Id like to comment on Joes jacketed bullet groups. You chose the Savage platform to use as a test basis, THE BEST choice on could make IMHO. This is a platform I am quite fond of and have considerable experience with (unlike the Rem 700 Uber-Rifles).

Those 22 CF jacketed groups are shameful- I say that based on what my Savages in factory finish have done (223 and 22-250). Not commenting on YOUR performance, simply that the rifles are not shooting as accurately as I would expect. Here where I live, Savages a plenty. Every freak Cal resident thinks he's a sniper. What do they buy--- a 223 or 308. If not sold a bill of goods (kool-aid that is freely distributed here in the land that Communism was formed and flourishing), they do buy a Savage. Then they do “usually” proceed to shoot .5 groups all day long. Makes them feel very good that they have shot small groups (They Become Mark Wahlburg!!). But a blind man with a Savage 223 BVSS and hunting ammo can usually shoot .5-.75 in a gale force wind at 100. Its not the shooter, its the platform. They inexplicably work. If it were just me and my experiences, I'd refrain. But its darn near every other Savage owner I have met here. Story is the same. I laugh at some .25 groups that folks believe are just the end of the world as we know it. Other owners laugh too, as we all know that Savages can shoot much, much, much smaller groups without any mods, or special fitment. Rifles assembled by- Aliens, God Himself, a special friend?----- by a stroke of genius or voodoo at the Savage plant, are made correctly the first time!! Just a factory barrel, headspaced at the factory on a factory stock (OK maybe not ALWAYS the tupperware ones- Ill admit)

I own what I will leave as MANY Savages. Not one CF 22 will shoot more than 1 inch, any conditions, any time, factory ammo, stocks, triggers. Now the bigger bores I have on factory ammo will do .75 to 1.5 with a scope on windy days (no accutrigger, just standard triggers). This includes 30-06, 270, 7mm RM. Be advised, I don't own an AXIS or the cheeps sold as combos. Genuine Savage 10/12/110/112 or Stevens 200. Period.

Not telling you YOUR SHOOTING is poor or YOUR LOADING is poor. JOE, here me now.... Not commenting on YOU!!

Im baffled by why your last entry, the Heavy Bbl 22-250 is shooting SUCH HUGE groups. Huge is larger than .5 inch (on jacketed bullets). This rifle should be shooting teeny tiny jacketed groups. TEEENNNNy TIIINNNY. Itsy bits groups. There should be no struggle to get day to day, all day long, hot barrel, cold barrel, bent barrel rusty barrel, crimped barrel groups of .5 inch. This rifle just shoots stupid accurate, in part due to 22-250 inherent natural accuracy (and I can't explain that but its true nonetheless). This is what drove me to type this message.

I have essentially the same rifle. My first group was sub .750 while breaking the barrel in. Thats the biggest group it ever shot. Smallest was immeasurable by me. ONE 22 cal bullet hole each at 4200 fps (bookoo Varget and massive case prep that folks here don't believe makes any difference in accuracy) Granted the immeasurable hole group came after a new stock and much in brass prep but........ it still gave .375 groups on Remington Bulk 50gr 40 count Bass Pro special deal day ammo. Thats with a Bushnell cheese ball Dusk to Dawn Banner 6-18x50mm scope. A $125.00 scope on a price match several years ago. .375 was the norm on TUPPERWARE!!

I know SEVERAL people with SAME RIFLE in 22-250, who ALLLLLLL get the same performance. I may make assumptions, but I do so based on what I see happen. Im an idiot though so .... think Jerry Lewis in rare form.

If the Savages are NOT shooting .5 groups with jacketed bullets of the grade and sophistication that you have displayed in the data, then the test platform (rifles) may very well be suspect. All Im doing is looking at the results you entered. AR's are producing smaller groups with pencil barrels than your Savage 223 is. I am NO RESPECTER of ANY AR! Were they used rifles? Beaters? Abused? High Round Count? Barrels unscrewed and rescrewed? Not broke in properly? Frankensteins? My 270 is a Second Owner Stevens 200. Idiot thought he was Mark Wahlburg. Camo paint stock, Clear DuraCoat on metal. Bipod! He put 400 rounds thru it so he says. Looks like maybe thats true. Its the poorest of shooters, I give that to the lack of ANY break in. He fired 200 rounds first day he owned it, not a patch run thru that day. Nothing like plating the barrel and then giving it a nuclear reactor exposure to finish it off. I believe the gun could shoot on the 22 inch crappy factory barrel and tupperware better had idiot #1 been better informed and done due diligence. Still, it shoots on par with your 22's. That SHOULD NOT be happening as I see it.

Im not a lucky man by any means. I didn't stumble onto 10 Savages that just shoot like crazy. Since they all shoot, I can make a fair assessment that they all (Everyones Savages) SHOULD shoot similar. This is where I am flawed, I assume way too much in this life. Maybe Im luckier than I think.

I see you have other experiences, 22 Hornet, etc.

I have only one cast bullet example in 22 CF. Contender 22 K- Hornet. 10 inch stainless barrel. Cut by Fred Smith at Bullberry.

It shoots cast loads (one bullet, 46 GR lyman rn) under 1.5 inch in the same wind the Savage large bores (270, etc) will shoot factory at .75 to 1.5. I will check my loading data next time in garage, I know I am not pushing the bullet hard but I am seeking IIRC AT or better than 2000 fps. The pistol pops primers with LilGun at 3k fps and primers fall out (34 gr Midsouth Varmint Nightmare). 2800 is about all I can do with a 34 gr bullet on a 10 inch barrel, reliably. So that 2000 fps is getting it done with respect to barrel length. It is gas checked with lyman or hornady checks, it is a softer bullet (not lino). The jacketed groups on a dead day with the 34 gr bullets are typically .75 and I can't get them any smaller to date. Its a pistol with a couple ounce trigger and not very heavy, floppy on the bench, etc. Cheap scope doesn't help either. I can hold better with other TCs but .375 is about my limit at 100 on a perfect day no matter what frame, barrel, cartridge, etc I can muster. With that said, I DONT expect cast to shoot like jacketed on any platform except 445 SM and 357Max. Both seem to perform best with cast rather than jacketed. My 6mm, nope. Any rifle I own to date, always shoots better with jacketed than cast. Using the baselines given by jacketed and my experiences with cast in same rifles, I only expect my best cast performance to be 2x a jacketed bullet group. OR LARGER.

I dont assume every Savage bolt gun of recent production to shoot amazing, but I expect better groups from them than your experiencing. A CF 22 on a Savage platform I expect .5 inch groups to be the norm. Cast performance I expect would then be 2x that, 1 inch. Your at a whopping 4x. And your jacketed bullet groups are 3-4x what I see as typical of MANY CF 22 Savages (and Stevens 200's for that matter).

The jacketed data you have provided is on target with my experiences and your cast bullet groups of 2 inches. The cast groups are indeed 2X your jacketed results.

Not a rule or law or scientific anything, just simply what I have observed in 10 years of Savage ONLY shooting (I despise Remingtons). All that I have typed likely has NO bearing on anything in life. But it sure matches your experiences to date in some segments and draws a high contrast to some of your others.

Not a finger point at you, Im pointing at the rifles. Something isn't right (and that something might be me)