Most used alloy for 223 bullets

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2frogs posted this 30 January 2024

Getting into cast bullets for 223 with a 12 twist. No wheel weight available here in Pennsylvania. In my area at least. So I buy from rotometals. I have pure lead some Lyman no 2 and some once used linotype. My molds are all gas checks. Would appreciate any suggestions. Thanks, Johnny

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Bud Hyett posted this 15 March 2024

Pewter in not an established alloy. Pewter is a malleable metal alloy, traditionally 85% - 95% Tin with the remainder varying amounts of Copper, Antimony, Bismuth and Lead. Silver is also sometimes used. Copper and Antimony act as hardeners while Lead is common in the lower grades of Pewter, which have a bluish tint.

I would cast what you have and see how it performs. Any higher percentage of Tin more then 2% is a wastage of the Tin. Bismuth can contaminate your alloy for castability.

Farm boy from Illinois, living in the magical Pacific Northwest

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2frogs posted this 14 March 2024

Can I do that with pewter as well?

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MP1886 posted this 06 February 2024

2frogs   Check this site out and you'll find your answer:

 

http://www.lasc.us/castbulletnotes.htm

 

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2frogs posted this 06 February 2024

I don't understand how to mix it. How do I do it for a 10 lb pot.. how much lead and how much lino do I use.. never good at figured..thanks

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9.3X62AL posted this 06 February 2024

I don't have enough '223 Rem with cast bullets' experience to comment intelligently on that subject.  22 Hornet?--Yeah, about 2k rounds. Lyman #225438 between 2000 and 2300 FPS with fair accuracy (1.3"-1.7" at 100 yards, dang crosswinds in Ridgecrest!).

This was done with 92/6/2 alloy, which is half Linotype/half unalloyed lead.  Same story with this alloy in 243--6K rounds among 4 rifles, RCBS #6mm-95-SP and Lyman #245496 to 2000 FPS.  Both will group at 1.25" at 100 all day long and have accounted for hundreds of varmints. 

25 caliber is similar--92/6/2 does good things in 25/20 WCF, 250 Savage, and 25/35 WCF.  This last one had 1-8" twist, so much over 1600 FPS and groups went 'Improved Cylinder' quickly.  Under that speed, it was a 2" at 100 levergun.  

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MP1886 posted this 05 February 2024

Excellent advice by pat i !

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pat i. posted this 05 February 2024

Cast some bullets out of the lino and #2 you have and see how they shoot before throwing money away unnecessarily on tin. You got suggestions from 25-1 through to lino so obviously maybe the stuff you have will work just fine and if they don't then pick up some tin to mix with your pure lead. Always keep "this ain't rocket science and until you try something you wont know" in the back of your mind.

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MP1886 posted this 05 February 2024

CALL GIBSON!!!!

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2frogs posted this 05 February 2024

I don't have any tin..now what..

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2frogs posted this 01 February 2024

That's a bhn of around 10 I think..

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linoww posted this 01 February 2024

I have found that for loads under about 1,600 fps in factory rifles you can get smaller groups easier with soft alloys. I have had good luck with 25:1.  There is nothing magical about the 22 bore that requires harder alloys. See the match reports. 

John

 

My load was running 2100 and it seemed to be the sweet spot. And a lot of my reason for using linotype in everything is my dad was a printer and we had four tons of it in the back yard!

I'm down to about a thousand pounds.

"if it was easy we'd let women do it" don't tell my wife I said that!

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pat i. posted this 01 February 2024

lol! the things you hear in a gun forum. 

Meaning???

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Larry Gibson posted this 31 January 2024

tomme boy posted this 33 minutes ago

 

lol! the things you hear in a gun forum. 

 

and so it is........

LMG

Concealment is not cover.........

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tomme boy posted this 31 January 2024

lol! the things you hear in a gun forum. 

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Brodie posted this 31 January 2024

2Frogs, 25:1 is twenty-five parts lead to one part tin.  That is the alloy.  Brodie

B.E.Brickey

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MarkinEllensburg posted this 31 January 2024

What is 25 to 1. ? What about at 2000 fps or 2500 fps.. thanks

25 parts lead 1 part tin

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MP1886 posted this 31 January 2024

pat i.   What you can get in the same cartridge with top jacketed loads, but there's a but.  Such low velocity rounds such as 30-30 or such don't count. Talking like 30-06, 7x57, 5.56, you know.  

Shooting for jacketed bullet velocities with a lead bullet is a pipe dream and something not encountered very often. I chambered up a barrel in 30x47 and used a 160 grain LBT bullet at 2550 fps. It was not worth the effort. I know you said you need high velocity to burn out a throat with Lino but it seems to be the gold standard with guys shooting around around 2100 fps in the matches. If it's as abrasive as you say the throat would be worn out going 2100 or 2800 fps. I've looked at barrels with high round count and except for fire cracking they still shot great. If the things were being moved forward from the wear from antimony I'd think the wear would be perpendicular to the bore but every one the cracking was across the lands which leads me to believe it had a lot more to do with heat than antimony. BUT as I said in my previous post I think a shot out throat is an easy thing to blame for a rough spell at the range, that along with a scope going bad.
Okay my friend pat, let's get this figured out.  First your 30x47 cartridge with a 160 grain bullet to 2550 fps is very well into the realms I speak of, of HV with a cast alloy. I also had told that it's difficult to do, surely not easy.  I also explained that the heat cracking (those words alone HEAT CRACKING) tells you that I said it was indeed the heat, added to by bullet friction, that indeed cause the cracking. You can't cause any kind of cracking with any kind of alloy, you know that. That fellow that I mentioned that speedingly wore his throat by shooting Linotype at high velocity MEASURED the wear. So for him it's not an imagined thing, it was actually physical wear of his throat. He was pissed to say the least. Because I wasn't a friend of his my telling him wasn't believed.  Well he found out. 

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pat i. posted this 31 January 2024

pat i.   What you can get in the same cartridge with top jacketed loads, but there's a but.  Such low velocity rounds such as 30-30 or such don't count. Talking like 30-06, 7x57, 5.56, you know.  

Shooting for jacketed bullet velocities with a lead bullet is a pipe dream and something not encountered very often. I chambered up a barrel in 30x47 and used a 160 grain LBT bullet at 2550 fps. It was not worth the effort. I know you said you need high velocity to burn out a throat with Lino but it seems to be the gold standard with guys shooting around around 2100 fps in the matches. If it's as abrasive as you say the throat would be worn out going 2100 or 2800 fps. I've looked at barrels with high round count and except for fire cracking they still shot great. If the things were being moved forward from the wear from antimony I'd think the wear would be perpendicular to the bore but every one the cracking was across the lands which leads me to believe it had a lot more to do with heat than antimony. BUT as I said in my previous post I think a shot out throat is an easy thing to blame for a rough spell at the range, that along with a scope going bad.

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2frogs posted this 31 January 2024

What is 25 to 1. ? What about at 2000 fps or 2500 fps.. thanks

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MP1886 posted this 31 January 2024

I have found that for loads under about 1,600 fps in factory rifles you can get smaller groups easier with soft alloys. I have had good luck with 25:1.  There is nothing magical about the 22 bore that requires harder alloys. See the match reports. 

John

 

 

That's true John.  The HV stuff was only for those trying to prove something.  You really don't need it with cast. Back in the BP days you know what they did when they needed more.....they made a larger caliber bigger cartridge.   Also shooting HV with lead alloys is much harder then the softer more normal alloys. 

John look at all the stuff that has been done with cast bullets in quest of something easier and better in both making them and shooting them.  There's been all kinds of alloys mixed with lead to make the bullet more durable and stronger. To name a few: Copper, zinc, and some others. Another thing done to get more from a cast bullet is a more recent one, powder coating them. Shooters are basically wanting their cake and to eat it too.  Anyone that tells you that powder coating bullets is easier and faster then just casting and sizing/lubing them is dreaming.  So far, so far, pc hasn't equaled the accuracy of plain cast. 

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