I use BPI filler in my 45-70 to fill out the case and ensure all the powder is burned, leaving a nice clean barrel. I got this tip from this website and it works great in my Sharps 45-70. The accuracy is now so good with the Sharps that I had 4 shots touching each other with my last 4 shots at 100 yds. Now I am trying to tune in my new 38-55. I am using ADI 2207 powder and this leaves the case only just over half full. I have tried 5gr of BPI filler and this fills the case nicely. The bullets I put together were .378” FN lead bullets, 20gr of 2207, Federal large primers,5gr BPI filler in Win cases. Accuracy was 2” at 50yds I have since slugged the bore and it is .379". Should I continue with the filler? Should I try to get some .380” or .381” moulds to try a bigger bullet to improve accuracy? Suggestions for moulds? Sizes/Models?? BTW, ADI powder is all I have access to as I live in remote Tasmania, Australia, so suggesting anything other than an ADI powder is of no value to me.
To use filler or not??
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- Last Post 19 November 2012
Kevo:
The Lee
DC 379-250-RF
will likely cast large enough unsized in #2 alloy for you. Link:
Lee specifies their bullet molds cast - 0 to + .003”
Honing aluminum molds larger in diameter like the Lee molds is not difficult if you really need to. I can advise on that.
I'd stop shooting till you get a bullet that fits about +.002-004” larger than your slugged bore diameter or the largest diameter that will chamber in your rifle. A chamber casting would tell you the exact size of the chamber throat for your maximum diameter bullet.
A plain base bullet or bevel base bullet like the DC 379-250-RF will greatly benefit with the use of BPI filler as the BPI acts as a quasi gas check.
Lyman and RCBS also make a variety of molds for the 38-55
Gary
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Thanks for that Gary. Actually it was your advice that I have followed with my 45-70. I'm using ADI 2206h Powder( can't remember hm off of the top of my head),350gr bullets out of Ranch Dog TLC460-350-RF mould(both gc and non gc), Recluse 45/45/10 lube,starline brass, BPI Filler & Federal primers. Load is extremely accurate. Hope to post some pics of the Sharps shortly.
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Hello, kevo. With my .38-55 I have found using either black or smokeless..ANY kind of wad will degrade accuracy. For smokeless, I am using 18.5gr. IMR4227..never had a problem with powder position..though I always tap case head on bench before loading. Now with my .40's.. .40-50 B.N. & both .40-70 Str. & B.N., I find using a .030” veg. fibre wad to be helpful. And in the little .25-25 Stevens, using Swiss 3FG, I have tried a grease “cookie” of 1/16” dental wax wad over powder & 1/8” SPG grease wad on top of that..rest of space filled with Puff-Lon ballistic filler to bullet base..with wonderful accuracy..But for some reason, that .38-55 doesn't loke a wad?
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If you're using a hard alloy,
i'd try something like 20:1 before I gave up on the mold. Softer alloy can “bump up” that much and will often shoot better than the hard stuff. Grouch
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i am not ready to do * the * final, definitive paper on fillers ... (g) .... but i have used cotton balls, toilet paper, bpi granules, parafine discs, cow, corn meal ...so far without ringing anything.
the one improvement ... at 64.8795 % confidence level ... is that for some powder charges/types the filler can improve ignition ...
i would like to hear about any experiences using ground corncob filler ...being as i use it as a tumbling medium for certain products and i have a sack or two handy ... i remember an early mention of it in the fouling shot, but dont recall any further results ....
if any cba type put there wants to play with corn cobs, i can send a sample if ya pay the desired postage. my pm doesnt work. try [email protected]
the mice would thank corn cob shooters.. (g) .
ken
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I am loading cast bullets since 1969.
I have read a great lot of literature on the subject.
And used lots of different propellants of european & US make.
I believe that if you have to use a filler ,you are using the wrong powder or primers.
Shotgun shells are a different story.
In rifled guns fillers are another operation to perform,itroduce another irregular variable and may be dangerous.
Keep it simple .and remember Murphy's law.
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BPI is an inert filler that does not absorb moisture. It is a fluffy ground high heat plastic that is about 75% less in weight for the same volume of corn grits. BPI also acts as a quasi gas check when used with plain based cast bullets and that particular the gas check quality will extend the practical load pressure range for the ultimate compressive strength of your selected alloy. Of course, the BPI will fill an air void of a reduced load to aid in better ignition. BPI is readily compressible also by about 50% or more. The quasi gas check effect of BPI is realized with about 25% or more of the case capacity being filled with BPI over the powder charge.
For loads not needing the quasi gas check effect of BPI, many other fillers are much less expensive and I usually use PRPSB filler or Dacron/Polyester batting filler. I recommend avoiding the use of Organic/Bio-fillers made from plant fiber, they all absorb moisture from the air and add that unwanted variable to the powder charge. Organic fillers can be dehydrated and stored with a desiccant to minimize hydration of organic fillers before use as a ballistic filler.
Sources:
BPI Original Filler,
PRPSB,
Dacron Polyester batting,
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Ok..got it. I used Grex until it was no longer available and then went to PSB buffer. I have not bought any in a long time, because I stocked up on PSB after my experience with Grex becoming unavailable.
So this BPI is another shotshell buffer, I take it.
I use this stuff under some circumstances and have established some rules for myself to wit:
Make certain the powder occupies at least 70 perfect of the case capacity.
Make certain this is some mild compression on the buffer.
Don't use it with long stick powder where it might mix with the powder.
I have given up trying to suggest to other what they should do, as it is an unproductive excercise, but this is what I do.
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"Don't use it with long stick powder where it might mix with the powder."
There's an easy fix for that. Simply store the rounds with the CB's down and primers up so it can't infiltrate the powder. I did this all the time with spherical shot buffer and the very chunky stick powder IMR 5010 and never had a problem. Btw, it's a good idea to do this with ball powder as well.
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I believing you are unnecessarily limiting your load range when using BPI.
1) I routinely use BPI with loads that the powder occupies less than 50% of the case.
2) Your mild compression of BPI is a good standard to follow.
3) Long stick powders have posed no problems to me with BPI at all. I routinely use H4895 in .458 Win Mag with zero problems in loads with less than 50% density powder charges plus compressed BPI.
BPI is springy! It holds the charges together and particles don't migrate back and forth between the filler and powder at all when the BPI is mildly compressed. My reduced loads are generally compressed 106 - 112% density.
The BPI is recommended by the manufacturer for use as a ballistic filler in straight walled cases. For bottle-necked cartridges like the 30-06 I use Dacron/polyester batting as a filler.
Gary
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Ken sez:
"the one improvement ... at 64.8795 % confidence level ... is that for some powder charges/types the filler can improve ignition .."
I like the high precision of your confidence level. The world needs more insignificant figures. John
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There are some other aspects to using a filler. Firstly the volume in the case is reduced, which means the pressure goes up. Secondly the weight of the stuff that comes out of the muzzle goes up, again increasing the pressure.In Germany Adrian Pitfield http://www.riflebulletcaster.com/ has used the basic recipe of 60 % of the weight of the load normally used In the case of .308 Win he used Vihtavuori N140 and the rest filler. He then had DEVA measure the pressure . Uniform pressure and good accuracy. He wrote several articles about it in CALIBER(in German) I tried it in some calibers one of them 7.5x54 MAS with good results. Reducing the load of a medium burning rifle powder will lead to insufficient pressure for a clean complete burn. Reducing the volume will increase the pressure. That works well for a reduced load. If you have Quick Load (computer program) you can see the effect of reducing the volume. Don't use the synthetic filler in BP cartridges it will melt and it stinks. (use coffee grounds)
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Ken sez:
"the one improvement ... at 64.8795 % confidence level ... is that for some powder charges/types the filler can improve ignition .."
I like the high precision of your confidence level. The world needs more insignificant figures. John
JoeB would be able to give it to you with 6 decimal place accuracy!
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To ensure that powder and filler do not mix, you can use a paper wad or a tuft of Dacron between the two. This still means you have to have some pressure on the components to hold them in place. NO mixing or shifting, and NO airspace.
Dale M. Lock
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