I have a good amount of experience with heavy bullets in 32-20; a friend is getting a 10'' barrel in .30 Carbine. We want to use the RCBS 165 Sil and possibly the SAECO 301. What is your experience and powder recommended ?
The intent is IHMSA competition at 50, 100, 150, and 200 meters; issue sights. Thank you. Richard
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Not recommending, as I never used the .30 carbine case, but for my 30/20 Contender 30 years ago I loaded the Lyman 31141 as long as it would chamber and filled the rest of the case with Norma 200. I don't see why it would not work with the carbine case also. That was before Starline, so don't know how it would work with modern brass. FWIW, Ric
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Richard,
Do you know what the twist is in the TC barrel? If memory serves they were 1:14", so I'm not sure how well the 165SIL would shoot at handgun velocities. This is only conjecture, IF it is a slow twist. With luck it is a 1:10" and you'll get wonderful results, please update us when you can.
I have a Remington 722 rebarrelled to 7.62x25 in ten-inch twist and it shoots well at 100 yds. with Sierra 155MKs loaded over a compressed caseful of RL7 or 4198, about 11 grs. Might try it at 200 and see what it does...
73 de KE4SKY In Home Mix We Trust From the Home of Ed's Red in "Almost Heaven" West Virginia
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Thank you, gentlemen. I'm told it is 1 in 10 twist. I know the fellow who owned it. I have a 31141 and have used it in 32-20 but not campaigned it at 200m. My 32-20 TC 10'' handles the 165 Sil. well and the Saeco 311, each with 12gr 1680 or 12gr 4227. The barrel should be here about 9th or 10th Nov.
My hope is the 165 Sil. can be seated long enough to allow the powder capacity needed. I don't have RL-7 presently. I do have Acc-2015. It may be too slow. I'll certainly keep you informed. RP
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Ric, I have that but I think a short body bullet as the RCBS 165-Sil will be needed. I don't know what current powder would be a suitable replacement for Norma 200, unless it might be H322 or RL-7. Thanks.
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The barrel is in hand. It appears to be one with 1;10 twist. I'll post a review when we get a chance to shoot it. Thanks for the replies. rp
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Anxiously awaiting your results!
73 de KE4SKY In Home Mix We Trust From the Home of Ed's Red in "Almost Heaven" West Virginia
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Some Ideas. If guy could fine Paco Kelly's original article
http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?365-Heavy-Boolits-in-the-30-Carbine-Blackhawk
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Gregg, thanks but the need is for experience with a Thompson Center Contender; not a Ruger Blackhawk.
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Richard, Norma 200 is available at Cabela's here. Not cheap, but less than VV! Ric
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I'm sorry Richard . I was thinking that it may give you a starting load with heavy rifle bullets. But I did not give it a thought that a TC would let you probably load the bullet out more not being limited buy a cylinder. .
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Not the .30 Carbine, but the .30 Herrett. I shot this is Long Range Handgun competition when the weight limit was lighter and the T/C Contender was the best option for weight.
The SAECO #315 at 100 yards and the RCBS 30-165-SIL at 200 yards were the choices.
I think the RCBS 30-165-SIL will be a good choice all-around for the .30 Carbine in a Contender. The .30 Carbine is smaller in capacity, but similar to the .32-20 case where the .32-20 CPA is shooting at velocities of 1400 fps.with 200 , or heavier, grain bullets.
Just be careful of a sudden pressure escalation when you work up a load.
Farm boy from Illinois, living in the magical Pacific Northwest
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Your contribution is appreciated. I feel we need the 165 RCBS because its short body allows more powder capacity. rp
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Some years ago, I tried my hand at Handgun Silhouette at our local club. I worked up a load for the .30 Carbine cartridge in my TC Contender with SSK 10" barrel. After more than a little thought, I decided to try RL-7. It seemed to be the right burning rate, in my mind, for heavy bullets in the .30 Carbine in the TC platform.
I worked up a load, carefully (emphasis on "Carefully"), as there seemed to be NO data for heavy bullets in this caliber. After trying a couple of different cast bullets, I ended up with the .308 RCBS Silhouette bullet (nominal weight of 165 grs.). I used straight Linotype, with a Hornady crimp on gas check. The final powder charge was 15.0 grs. of RL-7, bullet sized to .309". The Federal #205 Small Rifle Primer with a LOA of 1.980" was arrived at (good fit for the chamber and throat).
My notes indicate groups of 1 1/4" at Fifty Yards off a rest and 3" at 100 yards. I was using a Tasco 6 power scope. After a good bit of shooting off a rest, I had the distinct belief that my pistol was actually shooting better than my results indicated but I was reaching my limits with this scope's resolving power, at 100 yards, and my eyes. Further, shooting a TC handgun off a rest really tests the shooter when it comes to small groups at 100 yards (at least THIS shooter (:<()...
At any rate, this combination, gave me the results I believed I needed to shoot Hunter Pistol. We were using half size steel silhouette targets at 25, 50, 75, and 100 yards.
I never chronographed these loads. However, I was able to hold "dead-on" at 25 and 50 yards, hold slightly high at 75 yards on the Turkey, and hold on the top of the back on the Ram at 100 yards. This allowed me a good consistent target hold without changing sights. This particular scope did not give consistent results when changing sights. Further, during a match, not having to fool with sight changes was a definite plus.
I was competitive with the bunch I shot with (not the best, but in the hunt). My match scores averaged in the mid 30's (out of forty) and I shot a few 38x40's. I was at the limit of my skill level, at any rate, but it was a big help for field shooting and I had great fun while it lasted.
Disclaimer: These loads were never pressure tested and if you try them you are at your own risk.
FWIW
Dale53
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Dale, during the early 1990s a few of us who had 32-20s and a couple of .30 Carb----and a stray .32 H&R mag, developed some heavy bullet loads. Our result in the .30 Carb was : Saeco 311 165gr: 12gr 4227 @1400fps///////Saeco 301 195gr; 13.4gr 4198 @ 1200fps. Saeco 311 165gr: 14.5gr RL-7 @ 1400fps. ****** we didn't pressure test these either. We went by primer looks and recoil feel which is highly subjective.
These were developed for IHMSA 200yd course. Presently I have no RL7 or 4198. Thank you for the contribution. rp
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If your 32-20 (30-20) 165 sil loads work ok I would expect a little less from the 30 carbine. However if you can get 1400 fps. A well placed shot will tumble a ram. I also rang a few. Try H110 and R 7.
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The 30-165 has been reliable in tc 32-20 for quite a while, as has the Saeco 311 165gr. The formula says these need to strike the ram target at 1000 fps. Starting them at 1300fps should do that. I don't have H110, or RL-7, but I do have Acc #9 and a good amount of Acc 1680. These may come into play if we don't see promise using 4227. Thank you for contributing. rp
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Sorry, I shot big bore. Critters are bigger and heavier.
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Shootcast; these loads are intended for IHMSA big bore. rp
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It is 2021; I'll give a short update. At present the powder of choice is 4198. At 12gr we get blow back suggesting we have pressure to low to seal the neck. I expect we will go to 13 or 14gr. rp
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...not the carbine, not the Herrett, but the Raptor from Reeder, using the 204 Ruger case.
A real performer, it delivers a 100 gr round nose bullet out of a pistol barrel at almost 2500 fps, a 125 gr JHP at well over 2300 fps, and a cast 165 gr bullet at 2000 fps!
A bit more neck would assist with the seat, but oh well.
My barrel is just over 16" and my realised velocities are around 150 FPS more than the pistol barrel tested.
One Whitetail Buster!
I shoot, therefore I am
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A lot of great information regarding T/C barrels can be found here if you have not seen this page before.
http://www.lasc.us/BellmTCfactoryBarrels.htm
With rifle in hand, I confidently go forth into the darkness.
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