Proposed change to Rule 9.3 requiring moving backers

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  • Last Post 03 June 2015
Pentz posted this 23 January 2015

My FS arrived and to my consternation read the proposal (TFS 233-5) changing Rule 9.3 to require moving backers for qualification of 5 and 10 round National records at 100 and 200 yards.   I understand the rationale for requiring moving backers for very small groups.  However, our range will be unable to comply and our shooters will be DQ'd if any (not I!) record groups are shot that cannot clearly show 5 or 10 holes in the target.  I suspect other ranges in the NW are also in a similar position.  We would have to close our 100-300 yard range Friday and Saturday afternoons for setup and takedown; our Board will not allow that, and I suspect finding the volunteers to do such work is unlikely as well.   We have visiting and resident record holders shooting at our range.  This new rule is going to discourage existing and future shooters.  Please take this into consideration before recommendation of this proposed change.

Match Director

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Ken Campbell Iowa posted this 23 January 2015

which reminds me why br-50 and ara 25 score target shooting is popular ... 25 or 50 separate bulls on a single target board; no moving backers required. for cast 10 bulls would work, 3 inch bulls as per a bigger 10 bull plus sighter; bigger 22 rimfire target.

no ax to grind here, and nothing new ... just an easy format for smaller clubs to execute.

ken

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billwnr posted this 24 January 2015

The proposed rule is for group shooting.

I don't think this proposed change is wanted as it prevents almost all of the small clubs from holding group shoots. Hunter class records don't appear to need moving backers (yet).

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Pentz posted this 24 January 2015

I'm surprised this has not generated more response. It certainly affects military match group shooting.

Match Director

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John Alexander posted this 24 January 2015

I would defer to Wally because my copy of the CBA military rifle rules may be out of date.  But in Section 5 it clearly states that no backers will be required for either 5-shot or 10- shot group military rifle matches. The proposal for changing 6.1 would apply to the “other” (non-military) competition.

There may be other points of confusion so I will try to offer some background.

Backers have been required for regular CBA group matches for as long as I have been competing (a long time).  Rule 9.3  was changed in the 2013 annual meeting to allow CBA benchrest group records to be set without moving backers if all holes were clearly visible. This has lead to several clubs that have moving backers not using them making it impossible for some classes (Heavy, UNR, Pbb, etc.) to set new records at 100 yards, and unlikely to set any at 200, in those matches .  This was an unintended consequence of the not requiring moving backers.

As a result it has been proposed to change rule 9.3 back to the way it was requiring moving backers for group matches.  This will not be voted on by the board until after 30 days past publication in the Jan./Feb. issue of the Fouling Shot.  Member comments are welcome during the 30 day period.

I will send the contents of this thread to the Board for their information.

John

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billwnr posted this 25 January 2015

There's two sets of rules, Military and Benchrest. I believe the revision is requested for Benchrest.

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muley posted this 26 January 2015

this rule change , did not cause the other classes to be denied the chance at a record.

before this rule , clubs did not choose to put up backers, even if they had them.  the non

use of backers is a logistics problem of lack of help to the match director. if someone

wants to set a record or try to set a record, they should volunteer to help the match

dorector set-up the moving backers. we have more recievers than doers. thank you

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billwnr posted this 26 January 2015

What about the clubs that have no backers and are in the “boonies"? I think backers/no backers should be at the discretion of the club based on assets.

The clubs that have backers will still use them. The clubs that don't will be able to qualify groups in some categories.

Just tell the shooters that the groups may not quailify if all holes can't be counted. In any case “screamer” awards would apply as it would be a sanctioned shoot. If it's unsanctioned screamers probably wouldn't be awardable.

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Great Grandma Eunice posted this 29 January 2015

There are so  many misconceptions floating around out there about the proposed rule change to 9.3.  Here are a few facts: 1. Your club does not have to install a backer system. 2.  Your club does not have to use an existing backer system if you have one 3. Your club may still shoot groups at your events. When rule 9.3 was changed in 2013 allowing records to be set without backers it was in direct conflict with rule 11.15 which states in part...Nothing is allowable in local or regional registered shoots that would not be allowed at a National Tournament. Therefore, rule 9.3 should not have been presented nor voted on.  You can not operate an organization when rules are in conflict with one another. We are now attempting to correct our mistake

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Ken Campbell Iowa posted this 30 January 2015

GO TEAM !!

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shootcast posted this 03 February 2015

If the boards decision is to reverse the moving backer rule they should consider other changes as well. Any club titling a match such as reginal,state, memorial etc. and posting it as group shooting should be required to have moving backers. They are by advertisement trying to get shooters from a broader area. Local clubs wishing to shoot without backes should list the match as a non sanctioned match.

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Longbow posted this 31 May 2015

To bad there is not a way to shoot 10 targets one shot in each target then superimpose them to show group or score, OR is there? food for thought!!

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Tom Acheson posted this 03 June 2015

Post # 11 is not correct. ANY match can be held with or without moving backers, no matter what “title” the match is known as. In our area we shoot matches to have FUN. No backers and no NR recognition? Too bad. If you are in this just to be glorified by shooting NR status groups then you might want to re-think your outlook. These matches are almost as much social as they are competitions. The CBA is not defined by NR's, it is defined as people shooting cast bullets and enjoying each other's company!!!

There is no pink Cadillac in the parking lot for the “winner” and no one makes a living doing this.

The clubs in our area will NEVER list the match as non-sanctioned just because there are no backers.

Tom

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