I'm thinking about getting set up to measure chamber pressure. Is there anyone out there that could point me in the right direction. What I should start thinking about, what equipment is recommended? As part of my hobby I find myself more and more looking towards ballistics. I know its not needed for 99.999% of the shooters, its just a personal interest I have.
Thanks, Bill Cook.
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Here's an article that might get you started.
https://www.pcb.com/sensors-for-test-measurement/pressure-transducers/ballistic
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Thanks. I’ll pull that up.
From what I can find, Larry uses both the Oehler M43 and the Pressure Trace II. Once upon a time (2022?) he recommended others to look into the Pressure Trace II.
So far I’m unable to find a source to buy the Pressure Trace II and I can’t find anything related to chamber testing on the Oehler web site. I’ll keep looking. Bill.
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Yeap, Larry uses the Oehler M43.
After I finished with the Pressuretrace II, I sent mine to him....so now he has both to compare.
44-40 Website -https://www.44-40.org
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It’s hard to find either one that’s on the market. If there’s a next life, I want to come back as a protege of Mike Walker.
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Neither the Oehler M43 or the Pressure Trace II are on the market now. Used market is probably the best bet. Oehler makes the M 85 Ballistic Instrumentation. I does a lot measuring than the M43 PBL but it is pretty spendy, considerably more than the M43 PBL.
LMG
Concealment is not cover.........
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That is a shame about the first two Larry. I am glad I was able to do what I did when I did it!!!
44-40 Website -https://www.44-40.org
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Bryan
Me two, glad I was able to start when I did 15 years ago. Not sure why the PT II maker went out of business, perhaps just not enough purchases? The M43 software runs on Windows 95/98 and is compatible with XP 97. I've kept a laptop with XP on it as a stand alone computer just for the M43 PBL. So far it is running quite well. Problem is with the printer and keeping it working. The PT II runs on Windows 10 and I also have another laptop dedicated to its use.
In Conversations with Dr Oehler, the M43 PBL was discontinued because he couldn't get find anyone to rewrite/update the software program he M43. Probably why the new owner of Oehler Research hasn't reintroduced the M43 PBL. Probably not enough business to warrant it either.
LMG
Concealment is not cover.........
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My problem has always been "plug n play". Computers scare the mess outta me. I had to send mine back once to get it reset. He told me he could make one the size of a cell phone but it would cost a lot of money. Keeping it simple is what he said cost so much...if I recall correctly.
If I had been able to get a Thompson Contender with a few barrels, I probably would have tried to keep going......but.....
Between the box and laptops, I figured I better stop while I could.
44-40 Website -https://www.44-40.org
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I can stare at velocities and standard deviations ad nauseam but when I see unexpected spikes in velocity and/or SD, as I’m incrementally laddering up the charge, I’m in the dark about what’s happening. Like missing the last chapter of a book. Bill C.
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Bryan, Larry or Ed; could any of you recommend a book or books that discusses the variables that affect the efficient and consistent use of the available energy in a cartridge case. Bill.
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Bryan, Larry or Ed; could any of you recommend a book or books that discusses the variables that affect the efficient and consistent use of the available energy in a cartridge case. Bill.
That is a bit above my pay grade Bill. I will let the pros handle that one!
Somehow the 30-40 Krag, .303 Savage and 30-30 should fit in one of those books somewhere.
44-40 Website -https://www.44-40.org
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Thanks for that. I fished around and found a couple that might fit. I’m not recommending these, pretty much just mumbling to myself. I find I’m doing that more offer as I grow older.
“Interior Ballistics of Guns” by Major R.W. Ficken and others (Naval Weapons Laboratory) Classical reference on energy transfer, combustion efficiency, and chamber behavior. Contains quantitative treatment of how variables like chamber volume, case geometry, and burn rate relate to energy conversion.
“The Science of Powder and Propellants” by Jacquelyn G. Bevelacqua and John B. Taylor. A focused discussion on powder chemistry, thermochemical performance, and efficiency in small arms. Covers variables like powder shape, deterrents, pressure-time characteristics, and thermal losses.
Thanks, Bill
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I'd suggest starting off with Understanding Firearm Ballistics, by Robert A. Rinker first. It is an easy read in plain English. Then there are numerous books such as Briyan Litz'd Applied Ballistics for Long Range Shooting. If you google Ballistics you'll find quite a bit of technical pieces, but most apply to external ballistics. Refine the search to "internal ballistics" to find what's happening inside the cartridge. Keep in mind there are the usual conflicts of information because of old theories vs new information based on actual measurements and testing. Many of the old concepts based on opinions of what was happening die hard.
A few sites to get you started;
Internal Ballistics – Wikipedia
Internal Ballistics ‑ Hornady Manufacturing, Inc
Ballistics 101 | An Official Journal Of The NRA
Modelling of internal ballistics of gun systems: A review - ScienceDirect
LMG
Concealment is not cover.........
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Thanks Larry. You’ve always had my back on tough questions.
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Aaron
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