Revolver Shopping

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  • Last Post 05 August 2009
NavyGuy07 posted this 04 April 2009

Hey everyone, glad to finally find the type of forums I was looking for. I've been doing some shopping lately. I'm looking to buy .357 Mag, and I've found 2 different ones i like.

One's a Ruger, the other is a Taurus.

Now, obviously, Ruger is the classic revolver. Taurus seems to be the modern revolver, though, what with their Raging Bull series, and all that big barrel fancy stuff.

I'm just lookin for a stainless steel .357 with a black grip and a 6 inch barrel. 

I already own a Glock 17, which happens to be a .40 S&W, for those of you that are unfamiliar with Glocks.

So, what i'm postin for is to get some opinions!

Ruger is the classic, but they have none available, and are more expensive (generally a good thing, I would think). Taurus is availble, and about $100 cheaper for the same weapon, minus/plus this feature and that feature.ould I wait for a Ruger, or go with Taurus?

Sh

Opinions please? I'll be checking regularly.

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CB posted this 04 April 2009

Find a used Smith. If no on that wait for the GP 100.

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rbdave posted this 04 April 2009

only info i can give is look at the warranty. taurus has lifetime repair but they have had my raging bull since 12-16-08for replacement because it was deemed by them that it could not be repaired. i think it could have been fixed by a competent gunsmith. other than that i own several rugers and a few taurus and they are both fine handguns

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GBertolet posted this 04 April 2009

Smith & Wesson is the classic revolver, Ruger is the new kid on the block. Do what Pat suggests, find a gently used S&W. It will enhance your shooting pleasure at the range. 

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CB posted this 04 April 2009

Rugers are stout as hell, Taurus's are good values, but nothing beats a Smith trigger. Go over and look at the S&W forum's classified section. It's where I found my 31.

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KenK posted this 04 April 2009

The older N frame S&W .357 revolvers; model 27 or 28 are wonderful firearms.  There are a bunch of them out there.  Go to a couple gun shows or shops that carry used guns or look on gunbroker.

Here is an example that a very quick search turned up.

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.asp?Item=126414806>http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.asp?Item=126414806

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BruceV posted this 04 April 2009

Buy yourself a S&W. Back when I was a member of the “gun of the month” club, I bought, sold, traded and borrowed a truck load of revolvers made by S&W, Colt, Ruger and Taurus. They've all been good handguns. However overall I think S&W is top of the pile. For lots of heavy magnum shooting the N Frames can't be beat. I have a 6” M-28-2 and positively adore it. I carry it in a Tom Threepersons holster by El Paso. It is a perfect combination. That having been said, the L Frames is just about perfect for the .38/.357 bore. It will take just about anything your can reasonable put into the casing. The K Frames, ala M-19, are wonderfully made, light and accurate. They will however not tolerate a heavy diet of hot handloads. The best thing about the S&W is the excellent triggers and adjustable rear sights. Get yourself a S&W and shoot the hound out of it. You'll never regret it. Sincerely. Bruce.

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CB posted this 04 April 2009

My hands down favorite handgun used to be a 3 inch Model 13 but I recently picked up this 4 inch Model 28 and it's taken it's place. I'm sure the gun's been reblued but they did an excellent job and it looks and feels great. I paid $275 for this one so be patient and you'll find a deal. With the way the economy is now you might be surprised what you can get if you start putting out some feelers.

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AMMOe posted this 04 April 2009

Every Glock 17 I've shot was a 9mm, weren't they?? My Glock 22 is a .40 S&W. Anyhow...

I would go for an old Smith myself. I bought a 4” M-28 similar to Pat's for $165 two years ago It is easy to carry and digests the heaviest loads with ease. I bought a 6” version of the gun 3 years ago for my Son as his first CF handgun. He wouldn't part with it. My best purchase was an 8 3/8” Model 27 found amongst a selection of “fantasy” knives at a pawn shop. It cost me $225. The guns are out there if you keep your eyes open.

The Taurus and Ruger are good guns but the Smiths are darned sweet....~AMMOe

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CB posted this 04 April 2009

I want to start going shopping with you!!

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AMMOe posted this 05 April 2009

You'd be welcome. I've had a ridiculous run of luck at the pawn shops in Billings, MT. My buddy and I drove to town to get him his first CF handgun and fell into a M-57 6” 41 mag. He got it for $325 with holster and belt. On that same trip I bought a Model 12 .38 Special for $195. I bought a Model 625 marked “45 Caliber of 1989” in the box with all the papers and full moon clips for $300 last week. It's been crazy...~AMMOe

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barney posted this 05 April 2009

All good suggestions. I'm partial, however, to Ruger's GP-100.

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JimmyDee posted this 05 April 2009

"I already own a Glock 17, which happens to be a .40 S&W, for those of you that are unfamiliar with Glocks."

That's worth a comment -- even for those of us familiar with Glocks.

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NavyGuy07 posted this 12 April 2009

Woops. Made a typo there, it's a Glock 27, not 17. :P

And, thanks for everyone's suggestion, ended up with a Smith 686. It's just what I wanted, and I was able to get a discount for bein Active Duty. All in all, a good first-Revolver buying experience.

NavyGuy07

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CB posted this 12 April 2009

Good choice. Hope you have a lot of fun with it.

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JetMech posted this 13 April 2009

Agreed. I shot a 586 in IPSC years back and it did me well. Another gun I wish I had never sold.

Actually, we called it PPC back then. Revolvers were the norn, versus the “race guns” used nowadays.

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Ed Harris posted this 14 April 2009

Debating which revolver is best is like asking zealots of different faiths to evaluate the other's religion. Everybody has their own opinion, the right to disasgree and its easy for friendships suffer during heated debate.

These are my opinions and you have the right to disagree. I don't want to encourage bickering in the ranks and do not wish to enter into any debate. These are simply my observations based upon 20 years of experience in the firearms industry dealing with military and law enforcement customers, and as an active shooter who owns many and has shot hundreds more different revolvers over the last 40 years.

I admit prejudice. I worked for Ruger from 1984-87 and was Quality Assurance Manager for its Newport, NH Operations. In my engineering QA and law enforcement advisory capacity I routinely bought competitor's products off the shelf and tested them, often to destruction.

I own only one modern S&W, a 625 Model of 1989 in .45 ACP. My other S&Ws are older pre-war Hand Ejectors. It is true that current S&W revolvers do not exhibit the quality of workmanshop that older ones did. But it is not fair to compare a gun “hand built by little old men with files” against a modern one assembled from interchangible parts produced by automated machinery using the latest computer aided design and manufacturing with on-line statistical process controls. Individually hand made pre-war Hand Ejectors are superb, but no modern revolver could be made with that quality of workmanship today. The strength and durability of the old guns is inferior to those of modern metallurgy.

Older S&Ws produced prior to the mid 1980s do not hold up well when shot a steady diet of +P and Magnum ammunition. Prior to the mid to late 1980s S&Ws were plain carbon steel. Most frames would not even register on the Rockwell “C” scale, being typically 90-95Rb. Larger N frames were no different, just heavier. At that time law enforcement officers usually practiced with standard velocity 158-gr. LRN .38 Special or wadcutters and carried +P or magnum loads only for duty. Practice and qualification was haphazard and often not standardized. It was unusual for a revolver to be be fired more than 1000 rounds during an officer's entire law enforcement career. Durability was not an issue except for a few gun cranks who shot their guns until they wore out, then they got new ones.

That started to change in the 1980s. Law enforcement agencies began requiring officers to quality with the same ammo carried on duty. Qualification became more frequent than annual. When the S&W K-frame .357 Model 19 Combat Masterpiece first came out it was assumed it would be used with standard .38 ammo for practice and officers would carrry .357s on duty.

When agencies stopped buying wadcutter ammmo and started shooting +P and .357 all the time revolvers required more frequent maintenance beyond the user level to remove cylinder end shake, repair timing and to compensate for frame stretch. It was normal for a K-frame S&W to require adjustment every 1500 rounds of service ammunition. It wasn't until the mid to late 1980s that S&W improved their metallurgy to enable revolvers to stand up to a steady diet of service loads.  The L-frame and current fully enclosed hammer J-frames have reinforced frame bolsters and heavier top straps to reduce the former tendency of the frames to stretch and for the revolvers to develop end play and go out of timing.   Metallurgy also has been improved since the 1980s.

Modern S&W DAs when well fitted and set up have good DA and acceptable SA trigger pull, but not all of them come from the factory that way.  Purists will find it normal for a new gun to require some tweaking to be “right." 

In the early 80s when Federal agencies were still issuing service revolvers it was typical to buy 100 revolvers and “cherry pick” 60 from the lot for issue to a 60-student new-agent academy class. Each selected gun would then require would 1 to 2 hours of gunsmith time to correct minor defects and to make standard adjustments required so that a field agent's life could depend upon it. During a trainee's time at the academy any little glitches would be adjusted, maintenance required at the user level would be monitored, and the gun inspected at least once during the firearms training phase, and again after graduation before new agents were sent to a field office. During an agent's career the revolver would be touched by an armorer every time they went to an in-service training or qualification.

If you have access to an armorer, or have the tools and knowledge to maintain your own revolvers, or if you either spread your shooting among mulitple guns so that you don't wear one out, or you simply can't afford to shoot alot, the S&W revolvers are nice.

But if you want a beater gun which will always work, in which the design objective was to provide a service revolver which would go 5000 rounds of magnum ammunition with no malfunctions, no parts replacement or maintenance required beyond the user level, buy a Ruger.

The Ruger Service Six here was a security guard training gun. It fired over 100,000 rounds of standard and +P .38 Specials over the last 25 years.  It was shot thousands of rounds between routine cleanings, and has a really smooth action just from being shot alot. It came back from Ruger when the security company sent their entire batch to New Hampshire for rebuild, which Ruger did for free. Great customer service. The revolvers were no longer needed for guard training, so the range complex and gun shop maintained by the security company sold them off to Virginia carry permit holders who are range members. I bought one for $275. 

Their ten old school revolvers sold in a week.  They all shoot like this one. 

 

73 de KE4SKY In Home Mix We Trust From the Home of Ed's Red in "Almost Heaven" West Virginia

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Mike Gordon posted this 14 April 2009

I'm kind of curious about what constitutes serious abuse of an older revolver, a steady diet of service loads or a constant diet of mild target loads? I ask this because I am in the process of buying a nice pre-war S&W 32 hand ejector, after reading about all the fun everyone with 32s seems to be having. I am buying it as a shooter not as a collector, so much shooting can I do with this revolver without wearing it out?

While not a centerfire revolver, I have a circa 1980 S&W kitgun that I have personally put about 20,000 rounds through, and it seems to be holding up very well.  So would about 1,000 rounds a year be considered abuse of an older hand ejector?

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CB posted this 14 April 2009

I think the OP will be happy and more than likely get a couple of lifetimes of service out of a 696 without too much trouble. Let's face it handguns, like most guns, get looked at and played with a lot more than shot. I've never had a problem with any of my Smiths although I don't shoot them as much as some others might and never feed them a steady diet of heavy loads. Not because I don't think an L or N frame could take it but because I can't.

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Ed Harris posted this 14 April 2009

Mike Gordon wrote: I'm kind of curious about what constitutes serious abuse of an older revolver, a steady diet of service loads or a constant diet of mild target loads? I ask this because I am in the process of buying a nice pre-war S&W 32 hand ejector, after reading about all the fun everyone with 32s seems to be having. I am buying it as a shooter not as a collector, so much shooting can I do with this revolver without wearing it out?

If your .32 Hand Ejector is tight, without more than 0.002 cylinder end play, cylinder gap not more than 0.008 and it times and indexes well, you can shoot it as much as you want with standard pressure factory equivalent loads less than 800 f.p.s. with a 98-gr. cast bullet.  If the gun has noticable end play you should correct this so that continued firing doesn't loosen it more.  

Handloads should not exceed 800 f.p.s. sample average from a four and a half-inch barrel with a 98-grain lead bullet.  It is best to check velocity with a chronograph and adjust powder charges to compensate for lot-to-lot variations.  Do not exceed 2.5 grains of somewhat slower current Alliant Bullseye for a steady diet, or two grains of the older Hercules product. Minimum start load with current Bullseye is 1.7 grains. Velocities may be erratic below this. If you don't have access to a chronograph to check velocity, keep loads in the middle charge weight range of 2.0-2.2 grains of current Alliant Bullseye. 

If your sample average velocities creep up over 850 f.p.s. with a 98-gr. bullet limit use of those loads for occasional field use and not 200 rounds per week plinking. Watch seating depth.  Deep seating bullets raises pressure.  Wadcutters and .32-20  bullets when seated within the length of the I-frame cylinder intrude deeply into the powder space, so with those so you must not exceed the equivalent of 2 grains of Bullseye. 

Heavy crimps are unnecessary with these light recoilling loads and fast powders.  I get best accuracy using the Lee Factory crimp die with as-cast, unsized bullets, using Lee Liquid Alox with no more taper crimp than necessary to remove all mouth flare.

Enjoy your classic “Bunny Gun."

73 de KE4SKY In Home Mix We Trust From the Home of Ed's Red in "Almost Heaven" West Virginia

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454PB posted this 14 April 2009

If you look long enough, you may find a stainless Security Six somewhere. I found a blued model some years ago for $150. It has to be the toughest .357 I've ever owned, and I use it as a test bed for experimentation.

I also have a SS GP-100 that absolutely amazes me everytime I shoot it.

On the other hand, I own a Taurus model 66 that has been a good shooter and trouble free. It's a good copy of a S&W model 19, but not nearly as well finished.

Be patient and keep looking!

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CB posted this 14 April 2009

He already found a 686.

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AMMOe posted this 14 April 2009

I have both new and old Smiths. I don't as a rule routinely shoot heavy loads from my “pre -1980” Smiths but I don't fear doing so. I pay deference to the early guns but Don't sweat the new ones for the little “heavy” loads I fire.

I do have a question, Ed. I recently bought a 625-6 S&W “45 CAL MODEL OF 1989". What is the “..of 1989” about? A special year? Model? Mine is a 5-incher and shoots very well for the single trial I gave it. Why do you keep it as you single modern S&W?~AMMOe

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JetMech posted this 15 April 2009

As usual, I find Ed's comments right on the mark. My first revolver was a Ruger Security Six, a Sevice Six with adjustable sights. It served me well, as it did the previous owner, a law enforcement officer. My carry weapons now are auto loaders, a Kimber and a Springfield Armory. But when it comes to revolvers, I personally still prefer the Rugers, Blackhawks now. Tough, reliable, and owned and managed by folks that don't bow to political pressure.

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Ed Harris posted this 15 April 2009

AMMOe wrote: ...I recently bought a 625-6 S&W “45 CAL MODEL OF 1989". What is the “..of 1989” about? A special year? Model? Mine is a 5-incher and shoots very well for the single trial I gave it. Why do you keep it as you single modern S&W?~AMMOe The 1989 is a special model introduced in that year.  They still make the 625, in similar variations.  Mine is a four-incher.  I got it to replace a 1955 Target which had oversized cylinder throats.  I sold the 1955 Target to a collector, bought the 625 a mould and a bunch of lead with the change.  I got mine for plinking and it is the only DA .45 I own. I use it for when I want to throw big chunks of lead and watch the dirt fly.  Everybody needs one in that category just for the sheer fun of it. A guy toy.

73 de KE4SKY In Home Mix We Trust From the Home of Ed's Red in "Almost Heaven" West Virginia

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AMMOe posted this 15 April 2009

It is that, indeed! Thanks! I bought mine from a fellow who had another, identical “1989” five incher in the box unfired. Where he got them, I have no clue. I used it just once to test some prototype 180 grain JHP ammo for a manufacturer and it was amazingly accurate. I'm tossing lead from now on...at least as soon as I can find my .45ACP dies!~AMMOe

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NavyGuy07 posted this 15 April 2009

i wont be shootin it much, as i'm busy al week eith duty and details. Then it's a matter of gettin to the range with enough time to shoot a box or two.

 

I appreciate all the information, and request that the topic not be closed. I'd like to see more long posts like that.

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NavyGuy07 posted this 15 April 2009

By the way, I'll mostly be shootin .38 special with the 686. .357 Magnum rounds is a special treat when i'm feelin more like Clint.

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BruceV posted this 15 April 2009

The 686 is a great revolver. Sight it in carefully and it will give you a lifetime of shooting! With the smooth trigger it is extremely comfortable for double-action shooting. If you shoot a lot of .38 Specials, you will want to give attention to cleaning the cylinder to remove soot, etc. Otherwise the residue might make loading .357 Magnum rounds a little difficult. Sincerely. Bruce.

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NavyGuy07 posted this 15 April 2009

Here's a qucik question. In the little blue case it came in, there's a little manilla envelope with a silver .357 Mag shell in it. My best guess is that it's a round that was used to test the revolver? Just wonnderin if that's correct.

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AMMOe posted this 15 April 2009

I think you are correct. My 625 came with a little manilla envelope and a single, fired 45ACP casing.~AMMOe

PS: Good choice, BTW. The guy I bought this 625-6 from has a well worn 681 six inch .357 (Fixed sight 686) that he may want to part with. I'll be snatching that one up if I can!~A

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GBertolet posted this 16 April 2009

I believe the case is for a type of firearm fingerprinting. Some states or municipalities keep a fired case from all new guns on file for crime scene tracking,so the factory provides one with their new guns in case it is required. My Glock had 2 cases in the envelope (Blazers). I think this turned out to be a failed idea and may have been abandoned.

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AMMOe posted this 16 April 2009

Say! You may be right! I forgot about that program!~AMMOe

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[email protected] posted this 26 July 2009

Recently broke down and bought a Smith for my combat league shooting. A heavy barreled 686. It is a great gun but to heavy for a general carry gun. Still am fond of my old Colt trooper for beating around in the woods. I had a GP100 once and was glad I got ride of it. It just didn't feel right. Decide what you are going to use the gun for and find one that meets those criteria. Defense, target, trail gun, hunting etc.

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excess650 posted this 05 August 2009

For looking at and occasional shooting, I'm partial to the flatspring Colts, and the 41 frame variants in particular.  I have a 2nd version Officers Model 38spl, an almost new Three Fifty Seven 4", almost new Trooper 357 6", used, but not abused Trooper 357 6", and a Detective Special.

For double action shooting, nothing beats a S&W K or L frame!  I HAD a “Factory Tuned” Python, but let it go.  My Model 14 K-38 was at least as accurate, and my massaged K-frame PPC guns had better DA pulls.

I HAD a 7-1/2” SS Redhawk  that I had massaged the trigger on, and it was pretty good for a Ruger.  It had gone back to Ruger for rebarrel when I discovered a crack INSIDE the barrel where it screws into the frame.  I let that one go and kept a 5-1/2” blued Redhawk that actually shot tighter groups at 50 yards than did the 7-1/2".  Years prior, I had a Security Six or two, but the 5-1/2” Redhawk is the only one that I kept.

S&W was making special runs back in the 80s, and I do have some of those.  Like some of the other guys, I have a 625-3 (4").  Likewise, I still have the 3” full lug/target sight model 36 38spl, 5” 610 10mm, 6” Model 16 32mag, and some others like a Model 19 4” round butt 357.

Oddities that I've owned included the 45 Colt, unfluted 25-7(?), Model 35 6” J frame 22, a nickel plated Triple Lock 44 Spl, and Police Positive Target(early flattop gun) in 22WRF.

I consider Rugers to be workhorses, but older Colts and S&Ws as thoroughbreds.

 

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