Just wondering if anyone has used either the Lyman 311257 cast bullet or the Lyman 313429 cast in a .32 S&W Long Ctg? The 313429 is a wadcutter listed at 95 gr but my casting of WW is 86 gr w/lube. The 311257 is a 115 gr RN PB. Just looking for some guidence w/loading 2321, unique,red dot etc.
This wil be useed in a S&W M31 4” bbl that I had modified to a kit gun years ago.
Ken
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I like your Kit Gun modification of the M31.
The bullet weights of the Lyman designs you mention are close to the Saeco #325 98-gr. SWC and #322 122-gr. FN which I use in my Model 31 and Colt Police Positive.
These days I use mostly Bullseye. My standard working load is 2.5 grs. with the 98-gr. bullets and 2 grs. with the 122-gr. bullets. These are max. if you want to stay within standard pressures in deference to the older S&W Hand Ejectors having un-heat-treated mild steel frames and cylinders. I have a couple older guns too, so must be careful.
In post-1957 J frames with the Model number stamped in the yoke cut, you can increase loads to about 900 fps with 98-gr. bullets and 850 with 115-120 gr. ones.
There is some lot-to-lot variation with 231, so do not exceed 3 grains with a 98-gr. bullet or 2.5 grs. with a 115-122 gr. one unless you can check velocity. If your revolver cylinder gap is in the typical range of 0.006-0.008" 3 grs. with a 98-gr. bullet “should” give you 900 +/- 30 fps. and 2.5 grs. about 830 +/-30 with a 122-gr.
If your powder lot is on the slow side you can cautiously creep up to 3.5 grs. to adjust velocity over the chronograph, but stay below 950 fps sample average to avoid loosening the gun, as such loads approximate .32 H&R Mag. pressure in the smaller case.
Unique has less variation from lot to lot. I have used 3 grs. in older Hand Ejectors as a full-charge load with 98-gr. bullets. In later strong guns I use 4 grs. with the 98-gr. bullets or 3.5 grs. with the 115-122-gr. bullets, which equal .32-20 performance.
Red Dot is very fast burning. Some lots actually run faster than Bullseye, so I would not exceed 2 grs. unless I checked velocity. With a 98-gr. bullet that should be a full load. I wouldn't use Red Dot at all with bullets heavier than 100 grs.
Other good powders to try are SR7625 and PB.
Older lots of 7625 have a burning rate similar to 231 and you can use the same starting load data, checking velocity. Newer lots may run closer to Unique or PB, and you will need to adjust charges maybe +10% and check with the chronograph. In the stronger guns 3.5 grs. of my older 1980s lot ran 1030 fps with the Saeco #325 - that was a load I used in my Ruger Single Six in S&W Long cases, but is a bit hot for steady use in the Model 31.
PB charges run closer to Unique. Work in the range of 3.5-4.0 grs. with either bullet and check velocities as above to stay out of trouble.
Speer lists data for #2400, but I found I couldn't get any more velocity with it in a revolver than I did with 7625, PB or Unique, but it works well in my Bunny Rifle and gives about 1300 fps in a 26” barrel. In the .32 S&W Long 7 grs. is a full charge load with either bullet in modern guns, approximating the .32 H&R Magnum at 1000 fps.
Go through the Bunny Gun thread in the archives for more discussion, but this will get you started.
73 de KE4SKY In Home Mix We Trust From the Home of Ed's Red in "Almost Heaven" West Virginia
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Ed,
Thanks for the reply. I have printed it out to put in my reference book. Don't know if you have tried it but I did put togather a load for 85 Gr Hornady XTP HP with 2.7 gr of 231. That load chrono'ed at 1079 fps on a PACT chrono at 7500 ft elevation when I lived in Colorado.Temp was 75*. Load is easy on extraction and primers looked to be in good shape. Second time thru the chrono I got an avg of 1050 fps. Accuracy was good for old eyes. Kinda makes me wonder about some comments about the 32 S&W Long being only good for paper punching.
Ken
OOPS! a check of my log book shows the correct data for the 85 gr Hornady XTP load to be 3.5 gr of 231. Hope this didn't cause heartburn to anyone.
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Ed,
Thanks for the reply....I did put together a load for 85 Gr Hornady XTP HP with 2.7 gr of 231. That load chrono'ed at 1079 fps on a PACT chrono at 7500 ft elevation when I lived in Colorado.Temp was 75*. Load is easy on extraction and primers looked to be in good shape. Second time thru the chrono I got an avg of 1050 fps. Accuracy was good for old eyes. Kinda makes me wonder about some comments about the 32 S&W Long being only good for paper punching.
Your 2.7 of 231 with the 85 Hornady in .32 SWL brass is OK for general use, but max.
I load 3 grs. of current Alliant Bullseye with that bullet for use in my Ruger Single-Six, but it is “a bit warm” for the M31, so in the Smith I use it only occasionally as needed, limiting the number of rounds, definitely not for casual shooting in a J-frame.
73 de KE4SKY In Home Mix We Trust From the Home of Ed's Red in "Almost Heaven" West Virginia
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My favorite loads for use in a late model Police Positive and a Detective Special are with the Lyman 311008. They are cast of acww, sized .314 and lubed with alox. The most accurate load is 2.8 grains of ZIP for 850 fps from the PP. The second load is with 5.5 grains of 2400 with the same bullet and it produces 920 fps from the PP. In my rather elderly Hand Ejector I back the load off a couple tenths of a grain. I am thinking about switching to the RCBS 98 grain slug for the Hand Ejector. Should be able to run it just bit faster without increasing pressures. Neil
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NoDakJak,
I like the RCBS 98 grain SWC very much for the 32 Long/H&R Magnum. The seating depth is less and the front band centers the bullet in the throat very well.
Ric
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Slim
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This is a “me too” post-
I have wanted a 32 kit gun ever since I read that darn David Ward article in Handloaders Digest. (As an aside, I also started using “the load” at the same time.)
Just finished my own, now I need to know what brand wadcutter everyone likes-Speer, Hornady, Lapua, Berry?
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NEI #84 with its bevel base removed and base band reduced by .020 to produce 100 grain bullet. Casts .315 diameter in soft lead such as 1:25 tin/lead. Use 1.7 grs. of Bullseye in the S&W .32 Hand Ejector or 2 grs. in the later Models 30 or 31, or 2.5 grs. in the .32 H&R Magnums.
73 de KE4SKY In Home Mix We Trust From the Home of Ed's Red in "Almost Heaven" West Virginia
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Ed, i have the NEI #78A with the BB left off and a different cut in the same block the #81 with the GC left off for a 100-grain SWC. The short nose helped on some of the short cylinder 32's. Both of these bullets cast rather large and they fit the cylinder throat and chambers of the rifles well.
Slim
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If memory serves NEI #81 is very similar to Saeco #325, which is a favorite of mine.
73 de KE4SKY In Home Mix We Trust From the Home of Ed's Red in "Almost Heaven" West Virginia
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Ed,
Yes, very similar. If a 32 shooter is looking for a SWC bullet, between the RCBS, Saeco and NEI he will find one that fits his cylinder throats and length.
I believe the reason the NEI bullet shoots so well is due to the wide driving bands. This bullet can be driven at full speed in the 32 H&R Magnum handguns with little concern for leading.
The Lyman 311008 also shoots extremely well, I suppose due to its larger diameter ”€œ at least from my mold it is nearly .314” depending on the alloy.
I sure like the looks of those 32 Kitguns, S&W should consider a blued steel 32 Kitgun. Our stainless 4” Model 632 suffers from high glare with the sun at your back and the red ramp front sight washes out in the strong morning sun.
I hope I set up this picture with good clarity, I'm not very good with pictures.
Slim
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John Carlson
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Bud Hyett
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