SOME ACCURACY THOUGHTS

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  • Last Post 27 December 2015
joeb33050 posted this 25 December 2015

ON 12/23/15, SAVAGE STRIKER 22-250, 225646M, WLR, 2.350” OAL, FL SIZED RCBS, LYMAN M, TITEGROUP, 100 YARDS, HORRIBLE TRIGGER, 5 SHOT GROUP “

6.0 GRAINS, 1.25, 1.35, 1.6, 2.9 AVG 1.82

6.5 GRAINS, 1.15, 1.2, 1.75, 2.125, AVG 1.557

7.0 GRAINS, 1.1, 1.25, 1.9, 2.075, AVG 1.581 This Striker shoots better than my 12FV in 223.

I thought bullets were pushed in the case on chambering, irregularly, affecting accuracy. I crimped the case mouth in Lee collet die, then didn't, crimping doesn't seem to affect accuracy so far.

Bullets, 225646M and 225415, are GCed, LLA, unsized, and seem to shoot fine. Maybe sizing is an extra step we don't need.

22-250 and other reported big 22s seem to shoot as well as smaller cases. Long ago I analysed CBA match data and found that the small case doesn't help accuracy much, if at all. SS rifle guys are seeing this in 32-40 vs. 30-20 or Millers. Maybe we need bigger cases. I've got a 22-250 barrel on the way, I'll screw it on a Savage rifle and see how it shoots lead. Maybe use the 10 shot group method to prove one way or the other. Why waste all that powder?

 

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Scearcy posted this 25 December 2015

I have also wondered about small cases and large cases. I have observed (I am a poor tester but a careful observer) that some cases which shoud not shoot well, do! The 22-250 is one of these. I have been shooting (and testing) a 300 Blkout custom bolt gun. I have also been working with a factory 3006 for next years matches. The 3006 easily is the better of the two. Shouldnt happen as the smaller case allows 100% load density.

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gpidaho posted this 25 December 2015

I agree with Joeb, My 22-250 TC Encore 15” handgun is one of those guns that you wouldn't think would shoot cast bullets well, yet it does pretty well with the TiteGroup charges Joe mentions. Gp

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Ken Campbell Iowa posted this 25 December 2015

joeb : i am guessing that luck has provided a slightly better barrel for your striker ..... too bad you aren't pc allowed to try your striker barrel in your rifle rig .

but the big case-little case debate is interesting ... the 375 hh mag and 458 win mag are two cases that are reported to do well with cast .... maybe throats ... but then on second thought ...

thank you for the shooting trials, next you need to work on that trigger .... makes shooting more fun . have you looked at working on it ?? maybe the lawyers rivet them together nowadays ??

oh, will the striker and rifle boltheads interchange ?? or do you have an extra head for the 22-250 new barrel ?

if you rechambered the 223 barrel to 22-250 would it shoot better ?? i got a 22-250 saami reamer that gives 1/4 moa in shilen barrels ... wanna give it a try ??

ken

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joeb33050 posted this 26 December 2015

Ken Campbell Iowa wrote: joeb : i am guessing that luck has provided a slightly better barrel for your striker ..... too bad you aren't pc allowed to try your striker barrel in your rifle rig .

but the big case-little case debate is interesting ... the 375 hh mag and 458 win mag are two cases that are reported to do well with cast .... maybe throats ... but then on second thought ...

thank you for the shooting trials, next you need to work on that trigger .... makes shooting more fun . have you looked at working on it ?? maybe the lawyers rivet them together nowadays ??

The Striker has a mid grip, so the trigger has an official Rube Goldberg linkage from where the trigger IS to where it WAS when the action was a rifle action. The trigger can be adjusted to a reasonable pull, where it slam-fires. Stopping the slam-fires gives the horrible pull. I'm inspecting and cleaning and oiling and adjusting and shooting; and hoping that the shooting will wear things in. This is my second dance with a Striker, last time I got the trigger from horrible to bad. 1. Take the trigger apparatus off, throw it away. Buy a rear grip stock, $450, a rifle-basix rifle trigger, put it together = Striker with good trigger. 2. Same as 1., but make rear grip stock from a rifle stock. 3. Make a pistol-style stock from a rifle stock, put a rifle in the stock, looks like a long-barrel pistol. Cut bbl to 16 1/4", keep bbl >16” and OAL >26” and it seems legal. I have emails in to ATF to check legal. 3 seems to make most sense.

oh, will the striker and rifle boltheads interchange ?? or do you have an extra head for the 22-250 new barrel ?

I think the bolt heads would interchange, but don't know-haven't tried. I have spare 223 and 308 size bolt heads that fit my M10 and M12 rifles. The 22-250 barrel is a 22"? rifle barrel that I can put on the Striker or either rifle. I have 223 barrels that will go on the Striker, but don't see why with the trigger so bad.

if you rechambered the 223 barrel to 22-250 would it shoot better ?? i got a 22-250 saami reamer that gives 1/4 moa in shilen barrels ... wanna give it a try ??

Interesting. I have a 223 bbl, 22” long sporter. I could put it on a rifle, shoot for accuracy, then re-chamber to 22-250 and shoot for accuracy. But, I have 223 bbls now, and a 22-250 bbl coming. Would testing different bbls be same as testing 1 re-chambered bbl? Sounds like lotsa shots to know. Wait! The 10 shot test!

ken

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Ken Campbell Iowa posted this 26 December 2015

joeb: yes in my relatively small sample rechambering a barrel properly can improve the accuracy .

thus changing from 223 to 22-250 might not give a high confidence that it was the different cartridge; rather it could be the chambering job.

if we rechambered your 223 barrrel to 22-250 ....and it shot better ” substantially ” .... what could we say for sure ?? or we could just paint it red and shoot another 500 rounds .

the quest continues ...

ken

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joeb33050 posted this 27 December 2015

Ken; The 223 bbl is 22” long. The Striker 22-250 bbl is 14” long. Shorter = stiffer = more accurate?

If I hacksaw the 223 bbl to 16 1/4” , shoot, re-chamber to 22-250, shoot ???

How does bbl length affect accuracy?

Years ago some guys at Old Colony built 10# offhand guns with short ~18” fat bbls. They seemed to shoot, but were extremely ugly.

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John Alexander posted this 27 December 2015

Ken Campbell Iowa wrote: joeb: yes in my relatively small sample rechambering a barrel properly can improve the accuracy . thus changing from 223 to 22-250 might not give a high confidence that it was the different cartridge; rather it could be the chambering job. if we rechambered your 223 barrrel to 22-250 ....and it shot better ” substantially ” .... what could we say for sure ?? ..

ken Well maybe if we want to know, and I hope we do, first chamber the 223 to a proper chamber 223 and find accuracy first. Then rechamber to 22-250 with similar neck and identical (as you can make it) throat and see if accuracy changed. It would take a lot of load development and a lot of shooting but that is what we say we like. 

Many years ago when the American Rifleman was a gun magazine and there was a lot of hype about the wonders that a 40 degree shoulder would produce, someone did a somewhat similar thing with a 303 Brit (I believe) and changed the shoulder (maybe even in steps)leaving the throat alone.  The wonders of the sharp shoulder except for a tiny increase in case volume didn't appear.

John  

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frnkeore posted this 27 December 2015

Herters did double 30 deg shouldered cases

Frank

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