Walk About Contender

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  • Last Post 27 September 2020
mashburn posted this 19 September 2020

Hello again,

i made a post in the contender thread a few days ago about my walk about contender. It was a 10" Bull Barrel contender in .22rf. with a 1X4 compact rifle scope. I had installed a little light weight sling that you could sling over your shoulder air borne  style and carry with little interference. The advantage of the rifle scope was that you didn't have to get your head back as far as with a hand gun scope and if you have ever hunted with a scoped handgun and taken rests off of what ever is available for long range shots you know what I'm talking about. With the rifle scope and a non recoiling .22 you can shoot from positions and rests that can be and are very accurate without having to get your head back so far.

After the dreaded contender bug returning after 25 or so years I drug it out and decided to replace the compact rifle scope with a little holographic sight. I think this will be even more handy out in the woods. It is a little light weight cheapie sight with a 3MOA and a MOA dot. I've had it on a semi-auto .22 rifle for a couple of years and have found it very effective and accurate. It never lost it's point of impact in the two years so I think it is a good one. In a few days I'm going to be out in the woods trying it out on some gray squirrels.

Mashburn

David a. Cogburn

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Larry Gibson posted this 21 September 2020

If sling carrying a rifle or shotgun I prefer the method espoused by John Taylor.  It is what I used with the XM16, the m1 Carbine, the M14 and the M60 along with numerous other weapons during my many years in the Army.  As to carrying a "walk about" rifle I many times use my suppressed .223 Contender for such sans the bipod.

With a sling on the rifle [I prefer the older US web slings] the rifle is carried with the sling over the shooting shoulder with the rifle hanging upside down.  This allows excellent protection of the scope by the arm and body.  The right hand {I'm a rightie so for lefties it is opposite] has ahold of the rifle forward at the sling giving positive control of the rifle.  The rifle is slanted with the muzzle centered on the body.  The muzzle can be easily slid up or down giving positive control of the muzzle if moving through brush or if others are around.  

To use the rifle the muzzle is thrust out toward the target as a position is assumed twisting the rifle clockwise with the right hand as the left hand is brought over to grasp the forend of the stock and taking control of the rifle.  The should will slightly drop allowing the sling to simply slide off.  As the left hand finished the twist of the rifle to a vertical position the right hand slides back and grasps the the grip of the stock.  Both hands are a correct grip of the rifle for shooting.  The rifle is then "snapped" into the shoulder for a correct assumed shooting position.  Harder and longer to explain that it is to actually do.  

In CQB with tactical weapons close targets may be engaged as both hands grasp the weapon using "point shooting".  This is very fast and effective with some practice but only at very short CQB ranges.  When hunting, plinking or target shooting only proper shooting positions should be used before shooting.

LMG

Concealment is not cover.........

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BigMan54 posted this 19 September 2020

I guess that's an "outgrowth" of the Marine Carbine Carry.

Long time Caster/Reloader, Getting back into it after almost 10yrs. Life Member NRA 40+yrs, Life S.A.S.S. #375. Does this mean a description of me as a fumble-fingered knuckle-draggin' baboon. I also drool in my sleep. I firmly believe that true happiness is a warm gun. Did I mention how much I HATE auto-correct on this blasted tablet.

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RicinYakima posted this 19 September 2020

Mashburn,

By 1968 in Viet Nam, slings on an M-16 in the 1st Air Cav was an article 15 offense. If you were armed, it had to be in your hand or hands. As a combat engineer, if you were probing for mines, you let your security man hold it for you. If filling sand bags or setting demo charges, you could lay it within arm's reach. Repelling or jumping you had it strapped to web gear, butt behind the shoulder and muzzle down by your knee.

Ric

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RicinYakima posted this 19 September 2020

I do not know. I went through basic and AIT with the M-14 and it had a full Manual of Arms. Fired the M-16 first time at Ft Lewis before flying to SE Asia and that day we did sling arms, port arms and order arms. Did my in-country week's training with the 101 Airborne out of their base at Bien Wu. At that time they were mostly in the highlands and had slings on because they did a lot of climbing in steep jungle. No slings at the in-country pathfinders course nor the Cav. My younger brother started Basic Training in 1971 they had a full manual of arms and a bayonet course for the M-16.

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Boschloper posted this 20 September 2020

I was in the Stateside peacetime Army, First Cavalry Division, Ft. Hood, 1975 to 1978.  We carried our M16's muzzle down when it was raining and muzzle up when it wasn't just because it made sense. Didn't know there were names for it. 

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Boschloper posted this 21 September 2020

Maybe someone should start a "What I did in the Army (Navy, Marines, Air Force) and what year I was there" thread.  I had basic at Ft Puke and yes it rained a lot more there than it did at Ft Hood.  What I remember most about Ft Puke was the sand. It got everywhere. 

Of all the valuable lessons I learned in the Army, the most valuable one was that I didn't belong in the Army.  I got out and went to college. 

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RicinYakima posted this 21 September 2020

No, don't think so. I live in the desert so I don't have to look at anything green, like Viet Nam.

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RicinYakima posted this 21 September 2020

Boschloper,

I tried the "what I did in the Military" maybe five years ago. Got three responses and it went to the bottom of the list.

When I was in HS I thought about the military for a career. Dropped out of college and was about to get drafted. Enlisted to go to Helicopter Pilot school but that didn't work out. Went to VN as a combat engineer. Was promoted to E5 with 11 months of active service because everyone senior to me was dead in my squad. When I ETS'ed to CONUS, never thought about the Army again.

Ric

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mashburn posted this 21 September 2020

Hello Ric,

A divorce taking place in the county that my ex- wife's family controlled is the reason I was put in the army. The day that I was to appear in divorce court is also the day that I was called up for my pre-induction physical. I was one semester away from my college graduation. I did, a few years  later, finish my degree.

Mashburn

David a. Cogburn

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RicinYakima posted this 19 September 2020

 "you could sling over your shoulder air borne  style"

Could you explain what this is? You have used this phrase a couple of times and I don't know what it is.  We had them in a case strapped to our right leg and thigh.

Thanks

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mashburn posted this 19 September 2020

Hello Ricin,

Here goes a definition of air borne style. This is referring to rifles, when the command sling arms was given, you put the sling over your shoulder and carried the rifle with muzzle up and butt down. Air Borne style was the exact opposite, you put the sling over your shoulder and carried the rifle butt up and muzzle down (much more comfortable.). The rifle was not carried vertical, the butt was sticking back under your arm and the barrel was angled downward toward the front. In the rain you could keep your rifle semi-dry, because it was under your poncho,  when carrying by this method. I have no idea how you carried those "made by Mattel genuine plastic M16's". I still remember how to do the manual of arms with a M1 carbine and that kind of dates me. We had to learn how in Officer's Candidate School, why I don't know. That is one weird manual of arms movement. Now I'll get a question about "what is the manual of arms."

So, when I carry my contender, it is hanging upside down somewhere from my armpit to my hip, depending on what feels the best. (Air Borne Style)  I still, when walking and carrying a rifle, carry it Air Borne style. This Air Borne Style is much more comfortable and the rifle don't seem near as heavy I guess this was a early to mid 60's Army phrase.

Ricin stay away from the fires and you might want to migrate to Oklahoma,

Mashburn

David a. Cogburn

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mashburn posted this 19 September 2020

Ric,

Thanks for the info. Was there a Manual Of Arms for the M16? During my OCS tenure, I had a Tac Officer steal my rifle one day, man did I pay for that one. The best i remember I received 16 de-merits and had to write a military letter to the CO explaining why my rifle was stolen. The first week-end pass we got, I spent 16 hours marching around the flag pole with a full field pack. I marched for 16 hours. One de-merit removed per hour of marching .I leaned my rifle against the wall to dump the trash can in a dumpster and when I turned around my rifle was gone and he wasn't even my platoon tack officer. I still wonder where he was. I never saw him. He was on loan from the Scottish Army or somewhere if I remember correctly, one mean dude.(I didn't even know the Scott's had a army) 

Mashburn

David a. Cogburn

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mashburn posted this 19 September 2020

Hello BigMan,

I know nothing of the Marine carbine carry.

Thanks,

Mashburn

David a. Cogburn

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RicinYakima posted this 20 September 2020

My goodness!!! I never knew it rained at Ft. Hood! At Ft. Polk in LA, it rained every day to keep the alligators and cottonmouths shiny so you didn't step on them.

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mashburn posted this 20 September 2020

Hello Ric,

Also, don't forget the copper heads, pygmy rattlers, corral snakes rattle snakes and cottonmouths at Ft. Polk (In basic training we referred to it as Ft. Puke) Where I live, I still contend with the critters I spoke of except I haven't run across any corral snakes, YET. One of the reasons that I have chickens around the place, other than for the good eggs, is to kill and eat baby copper heads and pygmy rattlers. We also have alligators. You would love it here, you could come down and take some back to to help you remember Ft. Puke.

Mashburn

David a. Cogburn

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mashburn posted this 20 September 2020

Hello Boschloper,

During basic some of the drill sergeants wouldn't let you carry them Air Borne style, I think they wanted to get as much water down the muzzle as possible so that maybe in a day or so they could find some rust during  an arms inspection.

Mashburn

David a. Cogburn

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mashburn posted this 20 September 2020

One thing that I've figured out from military experiences, discussed here, I'm older than most of you guys. The M16's were just coming in use my last couple of years in Uncle Sam's Army. I was around them some but had no experience handling them or firing them. They weren't my issued weapon. I can remember when there were just a few in the Company, That was during the time of the Mattel Toy Companies ads that stated "You can tell it's Mattel, it's swell" ,so of course the phrase was born every time you saw one we would say "You can tell it's Mattel it's swell.

I really don't know how this contender thread has turned into M16's snakes and such and chickens.

Mashburn

David a. Cogburn

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BigMan54 posted this 21 September 2020

I went in the U.S.Navy upon HS graduation.  HM8404, The kids have it easy today. Texas has a lot better weather the the Great Lakes Naval Station in the fall & winter. Yes I know Texas weather changes every 15min, I know it isn't as bad as 30knot ice/wind blowing in off that blasted lake.

Trained with the M-16 in recruit training. Never saw another one until they sent me to Camp Lejeune. Why I couldn't stay in Calif. for all my training is beyond me. I was told that since I was going to VN, "swamp training" was a better choice. I just think somebody at BuPers just didn't like my name. Four or five concussions since those days make a lot of memories blurry.  But I seem to remember a lot of Hunting/shooting/fishing & camping stuff with male family members pretty well.

My Uncle Alan taught me "Carbine" carry. he suffered through the same school at the same place and the same time of year I did.

Sling your Carbine muzzle down on the left side for a "righty" left hand holding the forestock. Bring the muzzle up forward as you turn the Carbine rightside up by twisting your wrist. Grab the wrist of the stock and pull it up and back into your shoulder, raising the muzzle with the left hand. 

This was a great way to carry a Win 94 carbine when hunting the thick brush of SoCal.

I carried a T/C Contender in .22Hornet, 10" bbl sorta the same way. Except I had a 1x T/C scope on mine. Both eyes open, it was pretty fast to get on target.   

Long time Caster/Reloader, Getting back into it after almost 10yrs. Life Member NRA 40+yrs, Life S.A.S.S. #375. Does this mean a description of me as a fumble-fingered knuckle-draggin' baboon. I also drool in my sleep. I firmly believe that true happiness is a warm gun. Did I mention how much I HATE auto-correct on this blasted tablet.

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mashburn posted this 21 September 2020

Hello Boschloper,

Good idea to leave and go to college. I was one semester away from college graduation when I went in the army. I did go back and finish my college degree later. I probably learned more (especially about life) in the army than I did during college. I spent 7 years and would have probably spent more but if you happen to tick me off about something, I don't forgive or forget. I if I could be promoted to  A Bird Colonel position, I would go back but only for about 30 days and that's all.

I think our country would be much better off if we still had the draft in place. We're raising some young people who, I feel, needs an attitude adjustment". And I'm talking about the old Military not the modern one. When I was in the military you didn't have the option of quitting if you didn't like it.

Mashburn

 

 

David a. Cogburn

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mashburn posted this 21 September 2020

BigMan,

Are you referring to the M1-30 cal. Carbine?

Mashburn

David a. Cogburn

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