Still no primers!

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  • Last Post 22 April 2022
Idahocaster posted this 05 February 2022

Here in eastern Idaho I still can't find primers on the shelves anywhere. Maybe our market here is just too small to be worth it for the distributors. Anyone have primers available in their neck of the woods?

Tyler

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Bud Hyett posted this 05 February 2022

They appear in Western Washington, but few make it past the store personnel picking up for themselves or friends. The price is $79.00 and above.

I'm in good shape for this year's matches and the Nationals, but next year could be a challenge. If this does not alleviate soon, I'll be shooting flintlocks in 2023. 

Farm boy from Illinois, living in the magical Pacific Northwest

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Ken Campbell Iowa posted this 05 February 2022

i have been re-thinking electronic ignition ...  ever short out a 1000 mfd capacitor ? ...  remington was 20 years ahead of this game ...

ken

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JohnForrest posted this 05 February 2022

You give off alot of static Ken, not sure the average dude has your abilities?

 

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Eutectic posted this 06 February 2022

I was at a local big sporting store last week. Plenty of 9mm and 223 ammo all kinds of pistol ammo. Some small rifle primers 90$ a brick. A few types of rifle powders, no pistol powders. Powder Valley has some rifle powders. 

Hang on, there are a lot of shooters who are running out. Everyone is stocking up the first chance they get. I think supply will improve soon but the prices may shock you. 

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OU812 posted this 06 February 2022

I wonder what the current hazmat/shipping prices are?

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OU812 posted this 08 February 2022

Midway's average price for a box of 1000 primers is about $80.00. I just sold a box of CCI small pistol primers to a friend of mine for $40.00

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TRKakaCatWhisperer posted this 08 February 2022

i have been re-thinking electronic ignition ...  ever short out a 1000 mfd capacitor ? ...  remington was 20 years ahead of this game ...

ken

the 20 and 30mm aircraft cannon rounds are fired electronically.  It's faster/more reliable.

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John Carlson posted this 09 February 2022

True that 20/30 mm are fired electronically, but they still use a primer..  

John Carlson. CBA Director of Military Competition.

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longhunter posted this 09 February 2022

This is just not right!

I'm with the Grumpy old man!

Jon

Jon Welda CW5 USA Ret.

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Rich/WIS posted this 12 February 2022

Was at  he gunshow in Corbin Ky today. Plenty of ammo but pricey, even common calibers like 06 and 270 were well north of $30 for 20, even best price on 223/556 was bout 80 cents a round.  There were NO reloading components to be found, only primers in the place were the 4 K I sold for $60/K and they were gone between the door and the first table.  Probably could have got more $ but  felt quilty enough at that price. FWIW saw a number of guns sold but prices were ridiculous even on well used guns.

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Shuz posted this 12 February 2022

Idahocaster-- Yesterday the Black Sheep in CDA had CCI BR 2 for $11.99/C and small pistol Remington 1-1/2's for $6.99/C limit 500. They seemed to have several thousand in stock as of yesterday afternoon!

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Tom Acheson posted this 15 February 2022

A good friend shoots handgun silhouette with a Remington XP-100. It has an electronic trigger. But at our winter time (cold) matches, it does not function reliably.

Tom

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John Alexander posted this 18 February 2022

The local Sportsman's Warehouse sold primers for pre pandemic prices when they had them up to a month ago. Only on Saturday at the 9 AM opening first come first served. One pound and 500 primer limit. But got complaints from small time grifters who fared better  by inside deals and could triple their money at gun shows.  Black markets work perfectly as long as there are people willing to pay triple or more and stores help them get the goods instead of selling at normal prices. This could become a stable supply line at triple the price If we cooperate. Just because you are paranoid doesn't mean there not out to get you.

John

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John Carlson posted this 18 February 2022

On the rare occasions our local Scheels has had primers lately they were priced near $100/brick.  Manager swears they are only applying their normal markup but someone is taking advantage of the situation.

John Carlson. CBA Director of Military Competition.

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Ross Smith posted this 23 February 2022

Just saw 1000 BP caps(#11) for $150!

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Ken Campbell Iowa posted this 23 February 2022

Cci suggested retail on no. 200 lr is $70 . Extrapolate from there ... Geeeezze

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John Alexander posted this 23 February 2022

Does anybody believe it costs twice as much to make primers than it did two years ago? I wonder if we really have a free competitive market in primers. It wouldn't be the first time that other factors were at work to avoid competition and keep prices high to improve the lot of the poor stockholders. Some of our drug prices are an example.

John

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Bud Hyett posted this 23 February 2022

The collaboration between accounting and marketing is at the least "unholy". Accounting will set a price based on their research. It reminds me of my early days on the farm when we put blinders on the horses so  they could see only where they were driven. 

The initial product offering's final approval is always accounting to assure the company does not suffer. Even if the initial pricing is break-even to penetrate the market, there is a recovery plan to get back to a profit. Accountants run every big company and they are the "sneaky snakes" who look only at their balance sheets. 

As an example, in the auto industry, buying a car part-by-part would be five times more costly for just the parts, you'd still have to pay labor to assemble. The auto industry plan is to sell low and make a profit on repairs. 

With the new company in Texas entering the primer market, there should be lower prices. The other item is once the primers start accumulating, there will be sales. Alice and I have enough primers for 2022 and 2023, after that we'll be shooting flintlocks. 

Farm boy from Illinois, living in the magical Pacific Northwest

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John Carlson posted this 24 February 2022

As I understand it, Winchester's primer production largely goes to government ammunition contracts.  CCI, Federal, and Remington are all owned by one company, Vista.  The Remington bankruptcy shut down their primer production, not sure it has yet come back on line since Vista acquired it.

Certainly the great increase in demand started the whole problem but there seems to have been no effort to increase production to meet the demand.  As John Alexander commented, It seems unlikely that the cost of putting primers on the shelf has tripled (the few I do see are $100/brick).  Many other components are available at prices only modestly higher than before.  I can buy 22 magnum ammo and 9mm fmj at roughly 50% over what they were 2 years ago.  22LR are now available but at around $100/brick. or triple previous prices.  Even at $100/brick there are no primers on the shelves around here.

News of a new (and presumably independent) producer of primers is very welcome as would be access to imports, but that may be a while.

John Carlson. CBA Director of Military Competition.

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John Carlson posted this 26 February 2022

Clark auction today, primers mostly brought $200+/brick, one lot $300/brick.  Oh yeah, +13% buyers premium.

John Carlson. CBA Director of Military Competition.

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ten-mile posted this 27 February 2022

Well, I will stick with a flintlock before I use Russian primers.

 

I sell a lot of 32 rimfire cases that use 22 nail gun blanks.  I have thought a little about what I would have to do to make regular center fire cases work with them. I might make a few just for fun, but I don't think I will run out of primers.

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max503 posted this 27 February 2022

My club has primers for $50/K.  I guess that's a good deal anymore.  

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John Carlson posted this 10 March 2022

Just heard today that the CEO of  VISTA now says CCI, Federal, and Remington will not be offering primers to the public.

John Carlson. CBA Director of Military Competition.

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RicinYakima posted this 10 March 2022

I am sorry to say, but that is not new. 100 years ago Winchester, Remington and Union Metallic Cartridge refused to sell components because "smokeless powder is dangerous". Really they just wanted us to buy factory loaded ammo. It took 25 years till the "great depression" before they opened up again. Lets hope it doesn't take that long now. 

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Bud Hyett posted this 10 March 2022

Soon, CCI will be richer and the Vista CEO will be up for replacement. That simply makes a much larger market for CCI.

Last month, I shot my highest score in years with CCI BR4 primers in my .32-20 CPA. I had 100 and was using them up to save the Remington 7 1/2 primers for later in the year. Now, I'll use CCI BR4 primers in the future. 

I prefer W-W LR primers for longer cases such as .30-'06 and Remington 7 1/2 for .222 Remington head-size based cases. I have Federal LR primers that produce the same results as the W-W primers. But I'll  go to the range and tailor CCI LR primers for Military Rifle competition when I need to.   

Farm boy from Illinois, living in the magical Pacific Northwest

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Eutectic posted this 10 March 2022

Our local sport warehouse got in some primers and powder. Limit one pound of powder, one brick of primers. There were multiple checkout lanes and no one was observing. I watched one man come back twice while I was there, I am sure there were others. The next day the shelves were bare. 

I am sure some of those 90$ primers were on the internet auction sites the next day. As long as there are fools willing to pay $$$ this will continue. 

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wimilkman posted this 17 April 2022

Was at both of our Sportsman's Warehouses here is Las Vegas NV neither one had any primers and both now have signs up right on the counter - No Primers Available - there are none to be had here either. Once in a while Cal Ranch here will have them but they will only let you buy a pack of 100. I did manage to buy 600 from a friend at the Gun Club I belong to for $40.00, I am hoping Expansion Ammunition gets open quickly in Texarkana TX as they say they are going to focus on primers at first to help with the shortage, they purchased the old Lone Star Ammunition facility. 

Fred Honeyager

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JohnForrest posted this 18 April 2022

 Starting to see some interesting information about making primers on you tube. I mean we make bullets.

 

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Bud Hyett posted this 18 April 2022

Bullets are not explosive, do not have as much danger in forming the compound, and bullet casters have many years background forming the alloys with being careful not to introduce water into the melting plot.

I have the NRA book on manufacture of primers, experience with rocket fuel handling in the Standard Missile and Stinger Missile and this only serves me to question the knowledge base and experience of those advocating primer manufacture. These are explosive devices that require knowledge and safety practices. 

Granted, the Israelis did make primers out of matches for recovered .303 British with Berdan primers. They had two advantages: 1) they did not need to make an anvil, and 2) they could flatten the recovered primer cup for reuse. Also, they made powder from used film negatives for the nitrocellulose. These only had to function well enough to stop a soldier with new ammunition they could recover. These were not long-range accuracy rounds.

A problem in the manufacture is the usage of microscopically fine ground glass or sand mixed in the powder to function as super-hot ejecta going into the powder mass to aid uniformity of ignition. Where to get either the glass, or sand, and how to mix is another question. 

Another problem is procuring the ingredients and then how to mix. Mixing the compound can be either dry or liquid. Each time is another possibility, we cannot rely in statistics to produce a safe environment. No one looks good with missing fingers or powder burns across their forehead.

Also, primers can affect pressure and how do you test the explosive force and the range of pressure using this explosive force?

With proper manufacturing equipment and safety equipment spread over the time of manufacture you will approach the current cost of primers. 

Not to say this cannot be done, but there is a heightened cost and safety factor. 

Personally, I'll go to shooting flintlocks before making my own primers.

Farm boy from Illinois, living in the magical Pacific Northwest

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bucksnort posted this 19 April 2022

Then you'll need a permit to buy flints here in WA.

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Bud Hyett posted this 20 April 2022

I'll go to Idaho to visit a good friend and buy flints.

May become the the largest US flint smuggler.

Farm boy from Illinois, living in the magical Pacific Northwest

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Buttersdad posted this 22 April 2022

I was able to get a brick of CCI 500's a few months ago on Powder Valley. I went to one of the reloading forums I'm on to post that they were available and looked at PV site again and they were gone in just a few minutes. Later our LGS had Winchester WSP's with a limit of 300. Powder Valley was $70/1000 and the LGS was $6.99/100. I haven't seen any anywhere since. Since we don't shoot much in an average year and even less last year I'm still sitting OK so far. I just keep checking the retail sites and here, and rest assured if I find some I will post here immediately.

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