Bullets 12% lighter than rating

  • 4.2K Views
  • Last Post 12 November 2012
CANUCK posted this 03 November 2012

Hi everyone!

I am rather new to this Forum but have been a casual caster & shooter for a few years. I purchased a LEE C309 180R mould and have done a little casting for my 308 Win. I purchased some Lead bars labelled #2 Alloy but after casting the bullets weigh an average of 159 Grains! Thats about 12% lighter than their rating! Why on earth are they so light? Miss-labelled lead bars? Should I use them? I was thinking of adding some wheel weights to the next melting/casting session. Any help greatly appreciated. 

Attached Files

Order By: Standard | Newest | Votes
LWesthoff posted this 04 November 2012

I'm not very familiar with LEE molds; i assume the 180 is supposed to indicate a nominal 180 gr. bullet, but I don't know what alloy LEE uses to establish that designation. However, I am getting a 5 or 6% difference between a 2-7-91 alloy and my stash of linotype, and the lino is used and not up to proper (new) lino hardness, so should weigh a little heavy.

I agree, tho, that if that LEE bullet is supposed to weigh out at 180 gr., 12% under seems kinda much.

Wes

Attached Files

Brodie posted this 04 November 2012

The question that you should really be asking is : How do they shoot? If they shoot well all the other concerns are moot. Brodie

B.E.Brickey

Attached Files

CANUCK posted this 04 November 2012

I have not shot them yet as I am unsure of what data to use and why so light. However,this evening I used Lyman's cast Bullet Handbook to pick out a similar shape and weight. I sized & gas checked them and now they averaged about 164 grains. I am using 40 grains of 748 as my starting load. I am estimating from the data about 1900-2000 fps.

Attached Files

onondaga posted this 04 November 2012

http://www.castbulletassoc.org/view_user.php?id=5941>CANUCK: Use data for the same bullet weight as your bullets weigh or for the closest heavier bullet weight.

Sure 748 will work, but when you get a chance, try H4895, 308s like that better with cast because of lower pressure with H4895.

I cast the same Lee bullet with #2 and mine all up weigh 171 gr. 34.1 grains H4895 shoots that bullet in a .308 well and just over 1MOA for my grandsons Savage 11/111. Velocity is just over 2200.

Do not trust what lead bars are labeled unless they are certified alloys from a reputable dealer like Rotometals.

The Lee Hardness Test Kit is a good investment to help you with hardness testing of what you buy and of what you alloy yourself. Just adding wheel weight to what you have is a blind guess without measuring hardness. Test what you have and what you want to add, then you can do the math and get the hardness you want. Make sure no samples for testing were quenched and that they have age hardened sufficiently before testing.

Gary

Attached Files

CANUCK posted this 04 November 2012

I bought these lead bars at a gun shop while visiting New Hampshire, not certified alloys at all. Thanks everyone for all for the info! Reloading in general (let alone casting) in my neck of the woods is as scarce as hens teeth! I will try my 40 Grains of 748 loads and report the results. Many thanks from Canada!

Attached Files

JeffinNZ posted this 04 November 2012

I would be interested in the hardness reading on the alloy. Beginning to wonder if there is a bit of zinc in it. Did the bullets form well?

Cheers from New Zealand

Attached Files

Duane Mellenbruch posted this 04 November 2012

You might also look at the base of the bullet and see if you have a surface crystal formation sort of like a snowflake around the sprue.  I had some mild zinc contamination and tried tried some in a new to me mold that seemed to be casting undersized.  As I diluted the mix with good alloy the “snowflake” went away and the diameter increased.

Attached Files

CANUCK posted this 04 November 2012

The bullets did not form well at all! It was the hardest casting session I ever had! I have a LEE C309-150F mould and by bullet #3 or so I am casting good bullets. With this new mould I know I casted 100 before some good ones and took and addition 100 to get 50 good ones. I attributed it to the new mould, but now I am thinking differently. I will try WW alloy and report the results. As far as the base, they weren't perfect and I can't look now as they are all sized & gas checked.I don't have a hardness tester.:( Thanks everyone!

Attached Files

onondaga posted this 04 November 2012

http://www.castbulletassoc.org/view_user.php?id=5941>CANUCK:

There is a simpler method for testing bullet hardness that will also be “free” and give reasonable results if you have the patience. Link:

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?t=75455>http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?t=75455

There are many pages of comments on this topic. Beware of immature morons on the site and be objective about learning the method. It does work well if you are conscientious, have the right pencils, and understand the difference  between writing and scratching .

Gary

Attached Files

CANUCK posted this 05 November 2012

onondaga wrote: http://www.castbulletassoc.org/view_user.php?id=5941>CANUCK:

There is a simpler method for testing bullet hardness that will also be “free” and give reasonable results if you have the patience. Link:

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?t=75455>http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?t=75455

There are many pages of comments on this topic. Beware of immature morons on the site and be objective about learning the method. It does work well if you are conscientious, have the right pencils, and understand the difference  between writing and scratching .

Gary

Thanks for the info, I will need to get some pencils together.

I really learned something here today!

Attached Files

CANUCK posted this 05 November 2012

I only have a few of the listed pencils but a HB pencil will write all over the bullet, where a 4H scratches. Will get more pencils and post results.

Thanks everyone.

Attached Files

onondaga posted this 05 November 2012

http://www.castbulletassoc.org/view_user.php?id=5941>CANUCK:

The method does work and I hope it gives you a level of confidence.

Gary

Attached Files

JeffinNZ posted this 05 November 2012

Zinc is my call then if they did not cast well. That explains the loss of weight and the poor casting.

Cheers from New Zealand

Attached Files

CANUCK posted this 05 November 2012

I have used cast bullets for hunting my last dozen or so Whitetailed deer using a 308 Win. casted with wheelweights and a Lee C309-150F mould @ approx 2200Fps. I have never wounded & lost a deer and most drop in their tracks. I try to stay within 50 yards and place my shots well. With this new mould (Lee C309-180R) and harder alloy should I be concerned with using these bullets for hunting??

Attached Files

onondaga posted this 05 November 2012

http://www.castbulletassoc.org/view_user.php?id=5941>CANUCK: I hunt with BHN 15 Lyman # 2 alloy 30 cal bullets and prefer flat nose bullets to get the best expansion but also use a simple hollow pointing tool in my drill press for the round nose or flat nose bullets like pictured below. I use the inexpensive Forster 1/8"  hollow pointing tool with a drill press:

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/371968/forster-universal-hollow-pointer-1-8>http://www.midwayusa.com/product/371968/forster-universal-hollow-pointer-1-8 it is only $17.29!!

Attached Files

CANUCK posted this 05 November 2012

Thanks for the info everyone!

Attached Files

madsenshooter posted this 05 November 2012

I had some alloy that I think had quite a bit of zinc in it.  I cast some Eagan 30G bullets with it.  They came out looking like bananas!  You could see that the alloy had been right up against the side of the mold, then, as it cooled, it would shrink away.  They were large ingots a guy used for race cart ballast, hard to tell just what's in them.  Lost all my pics not long ago or I'd show you one of them.  It was very hard to find the ones that had shrunk, so I just shot them up at Washtenaw, where they have a very big backstop!  Luckily I didn't hit anyone else's target that day.

Attached Files

Chargar posted this 06 November 2012

Quite possible you have some contaminated alloys as others have suggested. That said, I have never had any bullet mold weight spot on what it was speced at. Weight will vary considerable even with different good alloys. I have never felt this to be a matter of concern.

Attached Files

CANUCK posted this 09 November 2012

Hi everyone, No range or further pencil testing yet but I will. I have done some casting with just wheelweights. These old wheelweights are 20+ years old and I believe (from a Sticky thread on sorting wheelweights) they are free of zinc & steel. They now cast averaging 168 grains. I have 3 scales so I know this weight to be correct. So still a little under the moulds labell. HB pencil scratches so they are softer than the first casts. Thanks everyone.

Attached Files

oscarflytyer posted this 10 November 2012

I use same alloy in all my molds - WW + 2-3% tin.  All my molds - Except ONE! - are within a few grains/2-3% of listed weight.

The one that is off, is off a lot.  It is a Lee!  Supposed to be a 44/429 200 grn mold.  But it drops at 217 grns!  It shoots good, so I just gave up and cast and shoot it with dat for 220-225.

Attached Files

IMR380 posted this 12 November 2012

Canuck:

I have the same mold and it cast light also. 165 grains with wheel weights. I also have Lee's 200 grain mold, and it cast closer to stated weight, about 195 grains with wheel weights. I have also read other comments about that particular mold casting light. G.E.

Attached Files

Categories
Search
Popular Tags
This Weeks High Earners
Hot Topics
Close