MARTINI Cadet

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  • Last Post 29 June 2021
helice posted this 19 February 2010

Gentlemen,

I have a converted Martini Cadet in 357 Mag with a 20” 1 in 13 twist original barrel  My question is what would be the better cast boolits to use with the fast twist rate?  I possess 2 LBT 180 FN moulds (GC and Plain Base), an LBT 150 OWC, and an LBT 240 PB LWN.  I await your wisdom!     

 

I have also given thought to converting this conversion to 35-30/30.  I have read here on this forum that some of you have Cadets in 30-30.  I have had a terrible time locating a chamber reamer so nothing has been done.  Of course same boolits listed above would apply.  Give me your thoughts on this convertion.

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mashburn posted this 29 June 2021

Ed,

Very good idea. You must be a lot like me and know how to do things with out big expense.

Mashburn

David a. Cogburn

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Squid Boy posted this 28 June 2021

I have a Cadet in 357 Herrett and it is very accurate with heavy bullets. It pleasant to shoot compared to one I had in 32 Special. Not that hard to make the cases either. Good luck with your project. Thanks, Squid Boy

"Squid Pro Quo"

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Mike H posted this 28 June 2021

A long time ago we had a gunsmith/gun writer here in Australia who wrote up his version of the 310/32WS,he was aware of the recoil with factory loads and the accuracy situation with the slow twist Cadet barrel.What he did was ream the 32 Winchester Special a fraction short when chambering so that the breech block would not close with factory cases,he then thinned the case rim enough for the action to close.At the time Norma 8mm bullets weighing 123 grains were available so he used them.I have no idea how many were made.

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SkinnerD posted this 28 June 2021

+1 for 357 mag. I too have a Rossi Puma 92 in 357..one of my favorites for feral goats which are not a bad comparison for smaller frame deer. I shoot a lot with 158gn cast out of hot loaded 38spl cases around 1450 fps..Also rifle level loads for 357mag at 1600 to 1800 fps using the same flat point bullet. If I hit them right they knock them over out to 120m. Not a lot of diff except the mag loads are shooting a little flatter. At 120m I don't aways get pass thru but its open scrub country and feral goats tend to just drop if hit well. At 80m or less I can knock them over all day long. Hunting in our bush, talking to a Sika expert of 30yrs, he would not personally use a 357 but would have no objection to one's capability. 80% of his kills being stalked to under 50m.

I have a Cadet 310 in 32-20 but have not had it in the field yet. On the range I'm getting 1250-1350 fps with 125gn cast but have not got the accuracy sorted to date. It too should be a killing round at small distances.

John - New Zealand

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45 2.1 posted this 27 June 2021

 

What to do, 

Any ideas on what - if possible - can be done to revert to a smaller cartridge. Other than a complete new barrel.

I want to retain the original barrel but I fear too much of the material in the breach area has already been removed..

Suggestions...anyone?
TIA

Bob

Several years ago I acquired an original Cadet barrel in the .310 Greener Cadet cartridge on the ASSRA forum. You might try there for an original barrel.

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Ken Campbell Iowa posted this 27 June 2021

  i would just load a 140 gr bullet and 7 grains of Unique ... 

...unless, of course, the real goal is to build another gun ( g ) ...

ken

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rjmelehan posted this 27 June 2021

 

“My first of many Martinis was a 310 that had been rechambered to Winchester 32 Special. At that time I had not yet began casting and when firing factory loads this nasty ittle flea weight sucker would just flat slap the snot out of you. It was no fun at all to shoot and quickly went down the road”

I have one of these “Snot Knockers” as well. (32 Win Sp)

What to do, 

Any ideas on what - if possible - can be done to revert to a smaller cartridge. Other than a complete new barrel.

I want to retain the original barrel but I fear too much of the material in the breach area has already been removed..

Ssuggestions...anyone?
TIA

Bob

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Goatwhiskers posted this 12 June 2012

I have a Cadet that was an original barrel rebored to .35 cal with a 1 in 16” twist and rechambered to .357 Mag. I recut it to 357Max and love it. It doesn't like .38's or magnums, also doesn't like anything under 170gr. I get my best groups (under 1/2") with a RD359190 plain based and paper patched sized to .359 over 29gr. A1680. Tons of fun!

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grouch posted this 31 December 2011

If you decide .357 mag or .38 special won't do it, how about .32 miller short? Grouch

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wch posted this 31 December 2011

For interesting info on the use of cast handgun bullets go to: lasc.us/AriclesFryll.htm

I have a Martini chambered for the 357 Maximum, and I love the thing.

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wch posted this 17 February 2011

+1 for the 357 Maximum-I have a Martini so chambered and it shoots 165-180 gr cast bullets very well.

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tjswallow posted this 26 August 2010

Hi All,

Really appreciate the great ideas out here.  Have been checking out all the forum entries on cadets lately and decided to go back and take another look at mine that I bought already re-chambered to 32 Win Special several years back.  Shop that sold it told me it was re-chambered for 32-20, which is sort of what I was looking for but turned out they were wrong.  At the time I figured no big deal I got a good deal and was thinking about having a whole rifle for the price of an action anyway.  I fooled with it a little with no luck and was going to return it to 310 Cadet configuration.  Even picked up a barrel back before EBay got stupid.  Started checking out all the info out here and got inspired.  Never could get any of my bullets to work that I used in my model 94 Winchester in 32 Win Special - go figure.   Wrong twist, what was I thinking?  What seems to be working pretty well is to use the RCBS cadet bullet (would make sense it should work - only thing that got changed was the chambering) in the 32 Win Special case.  I use a 32acp sizing die to size the first 1/4” of the neck and slightly flare the case mouth with a 32-20 expander die.  This allows the heeled RCBS bullet lubed with Lee Liquid Alox to fit nicely.  I put a light crimp on it with a Lee 30-30 factory crimp die.   Just started the load development work but the first groups of 2” at 50yds show potential using IMR 4198.  It's a lot of case for a pretty light load, I'm looking for about 1400 fps.  Going to start playing with “the load” next.  Man are these things fun.

TJ

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Reg posted this 25 August 2010

Have to agree with NoDakJak, you really must take into consideration that 3/4” extension dia.  Furthermore you must consider the strength factor as even less because it actually goes only to the minor thread dia.
I had two of them back in the 60's in .32 Spl and talk about recoil !! They just flat hurt with factory loads but had to admit I never did notice any chamber swelling. Am thinking if you really wanted something in the 30-30 class or bigger for the weight factor to control recoil, as well as additional strength in the extension, you could go to one of the larger Martini actions as there is a lot that can be safely done to them and I think they , in their own right , are a very neat action. Somehow the smaller action just lends itself much better to the smaller cartriges. I would keep playing with what you had. Play with bullet weights, slug the bore, try differant powders and loads. I have one in 32-20 and it took several years to find what it liked to shoot best but shoot well it now does. Also consider the .357 has taken a lot of deer and other critters as well. The success quite often depends on the guy pulling the trigger rather than any cartrige.

:coffee

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Al_Sway posted this 25 August 2010

I have taken one deer with my .357 Rossi Model 92 with a cast bullet. Performance at 75 yards was good - complete penetration and a deer that was dead within 25 yards. Good blood trail. Not sure how much more performance I need. While the .357 Maximum would provide increased velocity over the .357, it really depends on what sort of performance you are looking for.

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Daryl S posted this 24 August 2010

.357 Maximum would make an excellent cast bullet ctg. for the Martini Cadet.

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NoDakJak posted this 23 August 2010

I am a fan of both the 30 and 35 Herret cartridges but in order to exceed the 3030 perforance you must have higher pressures and you still have the 3/4” barrel tenon. If you stuck to cast bullets and low pressures this would be a safe conversion but many of the suggested hunting loads with jacketed bullets would surely jug a chamber and possibly dissamble your rifle. There are safer choices for this little beauty! Neil

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Poor-boy posted this 23 August 2010

I know that I'm late to this party but have you considered either the 30 Herrett or 357 Herrett?

Both use the 30-30 case, but it's shortened 1.605” for the 30 cal and 1.75” for the 35 cal. Performance exceeds the 30-30.  The shorter cartridge should be easier to handle.  Chambering reamers are available and dies are available.  Check the specs and loading information. 

Then there's also the 357 Maximum.  That's just a ream job with no other changes.  Least expensive option.

Overall cartridge length can be problematic in the Martini with the Herrett you do get about a  .4 inch reduction in overall length.   Don't forget that you will also need the extractor opened up.

It's your money and certainly your choice.

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NoDakJak posted this 14 May 2010

My first of many Martinis was a 310 that had been rechambered to Winchester 32 Special. At that time I had not yet began casting and when firing factory loads this nasty ittle flea weight sucker would just flat slap the snot out of you. It was no fun at all to shoot and quickly went down the road.
In the mid sixties I purchased a 310 Martini that had been rebored to .357 Magnum. It was a great little rifle and its preferred load was a 38 special case loaded with 11.0 grains of 2400 behind 357429. In a simpe minded moment I sold it to a hunting partner with the agreement that I had first dibbs when he tired of it. ALAS!! Twenty years later he still has the rifle! CAUTION!!! These rifles onlyhave a 3/4” barrel tenon and that does not allow very much chamber wall thickness when using a case with 30.30 diameters. You and I both know that this will provide enough strength for cast boolit loads but what about your son/grandson or nephew that may inherit this rifle. The late Frank Dee Hass didn't consider this to be a safe conversion and I certainly concur. Another conversion that was available during the early sixties was the 310 rebored to 44 magnum. I have seen very few of these and most had bulged chambers. I only got to look at a couple of these closely and they had also stretched the reciever ring, ruining a fine little rifle. The persons responsible for these conversions should have gone to prison for gross stupidity if for no other reason.
I am a definite fan of the Martini and still own several ranging from the 22LR up through the 577/450. My favorite has to be a Light Sporter Conversion that was marketed by SPORTCO Firearms in Australia. It ahs a pistol grip stock and a “FIELD” brand scopemount attached to the side of the reciever. A little jewel!! Neil

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helice posted this 12 May 2010

Al Thanks for the post. Your advice has proved to be good advice. I have decided to leave the Martini in the .357 caliber.
I've been disappointed with the accuracy of the Martini. I will try heavier cast slugs. When I feel a bit better I will slug the bore. Got a feeling that its a bit oversized.

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Al_Sway posted this 04 May 2010

While I know that the conversion to .30-30 case has been done with the Martini Cadet, my one experience with one that had been reamed to .32 WCF (edited, I meant the .32 Special)   does not lead me to recommend this conversion.
The action is barely long enough to allow for the case to 'get around the corner' as the access to the chamber is along the curved breachblock.
Why not continue to use it in .357 Magnum? A good sized round for the action.

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