I would like to try bullets with both conventional lube in the grooves as well as tumble lube.
What is the best way to heat the bullets for tumble lubing without melting the lube in the grooves? The kitchen oven won't set lower than 170 F which is too hot, at least for the lube I am using. Any ideas?
Maybe just thinning the tumble lube and applying cold is the best approach.
Any and all advice appreciated.
John
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I found a small crock pot that works well. It holds about a quart. I found it at Good Will for $1.00. After I showed it to my wife she gave me another one she had, so now I have 2. Glenn
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consider a heat gun ...these are much hotter than a hair dryer, so be careful. as in don't walk off and leave them .
harbor freight has one for $13 or so.
then there are the 900 watt hot plates at walmart ...$20 ... can keep your man cave coffee warm also ....
ken
edit:: the heat gun can also melt chamber casting sulfur and warm the barrel pre-pouring ...also the gun and hot plate can heat up your mold ...
just a few hot tips ...
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Thanks for the suggestions. I wrote my request for advice at 3AM (Ah the Golden Years) and wasn't clear. The problem isn't how to get some heat into the bullets but rather how to do it without getting them hotter about 130F and melting the conventional lube out of the grooves.
Glenn, How long does it take to warm the bullets in your crock pot? Does it have temperature adjustment and if so what do you set it at?
John
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Size and seat gas check to bullet before applying Alox lube
Microwave some Alox lube in a small Dixie cup (trimmed shorter) then dip just the bands of the cool bullet. Next rest bullets base first on wax paper to cool and cure...usually takes about 12 hours. Run back thru Lee sizer to remove excess. Alox will gum up seating die.
I wipe the base of bullet clean with a paper towel and mineral spirits before seating bullet. This prevents fine grain powder sticking to base.
Some people thin the Alox with miniral sprits then tumble whole bullets.
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No temp adjustment but I put a metal thermometer in the center. If it is full of bullets I will mix at about 10 minutes and watch the thermometer. About 15 minutes total. With one half a pot full about 10 minutes. Another good use is if I over lub I just put the bullets back in the pot and add a few more unlubed bullets and tumble. I have found the thinner the better. Glenn
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The old NRA formula 50/50 Alox and Bees wax may work well if you lube bands only in a lubrisizer. I do not like sizing bullets base first in these...only lubing base first with .002 oversize sizing die.
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John, I have experimented with coating the bore ride section of bullet, but found it very messy and time consuming. More trouble than it was worth. Maybe dipping the tip of loaded rounds in thinned alox is what your looking for?
Mr. Harris recommends treating barrel with Alox before firing?
Trick is finding a bullet that shoots well to begin with and then experiment with lubes, but you know that.
edit, edit, edit...
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Try my simple method that works every time with any batch size.
This works fine with Lee LLA or Whites Deluxe 45:45:10
My method for warming the liquid before squirting it is even simpler. Keep the lube in small squirt bottle about 4 oz . put bottle in a bowl and run hot tap water on it while the bullets are in the oven. They are both done in 5 minutes and ready to use use.
With both bullets and lube warmed, you will see the haze appear while tumbling 1 minute and the lube is beginning to dry. the lube will be completely dry in less than 5 minutes and bullets ready to load.
The people that say silly insulting stuff about how messy tumble lube is are simply not basically neat /clean people. My method is spotless, fast and simple.
You can read more about the use of tumble lube in an older post of mine here: http://www.castbulletassoc.org/viewtopic.php?id=9290&forumid=16
Gary
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Onondaga,I have read in many of your posts about the importance of bullet fit and how much effort and hard work you put into achieving a perfect fit. Would you please describe your technique for fitting both rifle and revolver bullets to their respective guns. Thanks,Rocky
Lifetime NRA since 1956, NRA Benefactor, USN Member, CBA Member
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Tumble lube the bullets first, then run them through the sizer. Or, run the bullets through your sizer with the heat on. Let the bullets sit in the heated sizer for a minute or two until warm. Then tumble lube them as they come out of the sizer, still warm. You'll need to be able to control your heaters temps to do this.
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Onondaga,I have read in many of your posts about the importance of bullet fit and how much effort and hard work you put into achieving a perfect fit. Would you please describe your technique for fitting both rifle and revolver bullets to their respective guns.
Thanks,Rocky
I specifically use the ink test and ink the driving band exposed on a dummy round. A chambered/un-chambered inked dummy showing slide marks on the band fits the chamber throat. . The largest diameter cast bullet that will chamber/un-chamber comfortably is the best fit for a cast bullet to provide a stable start and has the highest accuracy potential. This is the same for all cast bullet shooting in general. Do your testing with an un-lubed bullet because lube is not relevant to fit.
My best fit usually involves honing a bullet sizing die or a mold or both to pass the ink test.
Gary
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I finally found a good bullet and alloy that would shoot consistently good. So I thought I would give the strait Alox another try and compare it to LBT soft Blue. Maybe more shoots can be fired without cleaning barrel.
I dipped these bullets twice to fill lube groove. First dip was allowed to cure overnight. Second dip was this morning. These will be ran back thru sizer to remove excess Alox.
Barrel bore will be treated with thin coat of Alox before firing.
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The dipping method is popular. I have tried it too after RanchDog wrote about the method. Handling each bullet individually gives a personal touch to each bullet. but I get equal accuracy from my much easier tumble with warmed bullets and warmed 45:45:10 and my fingers never even touch the bullets when I do 500 at a time and they dry in under 5 minutes clear and tack free with zero dripping.
It is not just a philosophical difference for me. The warmed tumble method I use provides ample lube and does run a lot cleaner in my bullet seating dies and is also way cleaner when I use a crimp die too. Dipping leaves excessive lube in dies for me and requires frequent checking and cleaning. Dipped lube done heavy like RD and yourself is partially skinned off when seating bullets leaving clumps of lube in dies and on finished ammo with no benefit over warm tumbling that I can observe.
A gallon of Whites Deluxe 45:45:10 is about $15 and is a lifetime supply for most shooters.
Gary
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John,I might suggest a roll coating process where a thin coating of ALOX is applied to any flat surface that will release the coating e.g. a polyethylene cutting board, then carefully roll your cast bullets across that surface. I am sure that they will pick up a thin coating over the lube in the grooves. You might be able to prewarm the cutting board with an IR lamp just above RT if needed. It should not melt the lube in the grooves of the bullets. This is somewhat like applying case lube with a RCBS foam that has their lube smeared on it.Loren
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I use my fingers, loaded ctgs, smear on the LLA, put them in the green box, they dry overnight.
(I tumble lube very thin coat LLA, dry, size, nose size and load. Need to lube before sizing mine. Above is answer/suggestion to John's question) joe b.
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I not only got several good suggestions for my specific question but heard of a couple tricks that although weren't answers to my question gave me a couple of additions to my “have to try that” list.
Thanks for the help.
John
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John, I can turn on the electric oven for about 1 minute turn it off and wait 5 minutes and it stabilizes about ~90 F. Another way is the method I use to soften lube or run elevated temperature ammo checks in the winter. Fill a quart jug with water about 5 - 10 degrees hotter than the temperature you want. Put it in a cooler, put in bullets in a wire basket so air circulates. Close cooler wait ~30 minutes. I like the cooler method it gives good control. It is easier to fill the lube grooves using a lube-sizer if the bullets are warm.
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John,I might suggest a roll coating process where a thin coating of ALOX is applied to any flat surface that will release the coating e.g. a polyethylene cutting board, then carefully roll your cast bullets across that surface. I am sure that they will pick up a thin coating over the lube in the grooves. You might be able to prewarm the cutting board with an IR lamp just above RT if needed. It should not melt the lube in the grooves of the bullets. This is somewhat like applying case lube with a RCBS foam that has their lube smeared on it.Loren
Loren,
Tumble lubes are a surface lubricant and do not function in a lube groove by flowing out of the lube groove to lubricate a barrel when shooting. Loading lube grooves full with tumble lube only contributes to the unnecessary mess you read about when the tumble lube products are misused. Tumble lube is a neat and clean product and method with simple instructions that are ritually aborted by traditional pressure lube enthusiasts due to their rage from their tool investment cost and their denied obsolescence of the tired old pressure lube method because the tumble lube method has been developed by Lee instead of the pressure lubrisizer companies.
The arguments humorously resemble the Crucades of one religion against another religion that is wrong. Lubrisizers are like Philistines in Florida.
Gary
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Don't worry about heating the bullets.... room temperature is fine. Heat the tumble lube in a hot cup of water before application.
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Onondaga,
I just ordered 32oz. size bottle along with their skin care cream for my wife. Thanks for your help.
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