1st time w/85 gr. .224

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  • Last Post 05 June 2015
PETE posted this 03 June 2015

Any Question Pete

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John Alexander posted this 03 June 2015

Excellent first bunch of groups assuming 100 yard range.

Tell us more.  Rifle? twist? nose diameter? sizing diameter? mold maker and mold? load? etc.

John 

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PETE posted this 04 June 2015

"Tell us more. Rifle? twist? nose diameter? sizing diameter? mold maker and mold? load? etc."

John, Ok. But at this time I'm only going to give you the bare-bones answer to your questions. As I'm sure your aware the full explanation is in the details. If when I'm done you have questions on the details feel free. I'd appreciate it tho if you'd just pick one topic at a time. I'm not a fast typer. This message took better than an hour. and to describe each of the following details will take as long if not longer.

All groups were shot at 100 yds. as you thought.

The rifle is an “off the Shelf” Savage Model 12 in .223 cal. with a 26” barrel. Twist is 1-9".

Nose Diam. - .220"

Sizing Diam. - .224"

Mold - LBT 225 85 SP

Loads(s) - You might not be able to read the loads/group diam.'s but there are 4 different wgt.'s of IMR 4198. Target #2 is 11.0 grs. and measures 1 3/4". Target #3 is 11.5 grs. and measures 1 11/16". I didn't include the flyer as I knew what the problem was before I pulled the trigger, but didn't have any more rds. of that load so just took a chance it might go into the group. Target #4 was 12.0 grs. and measures 1 3/16". Target #5 is 12.5 grs. and measures 3/4".

No tipping of the bullets with any load.

Etc. - I'll wait till you have specific questions. :)

The thing to remember is this was the first time out with the rifle, bullet, powder/loads and was strictly meant to see what was gonna happen. The type powder was kind of a no-brainer as it works well with all the bullets I've tried in this rifle. Powder charge for the bullet wgt. was a guess on my part. Nothing special was done to the cases. Just pulled them out of the bin of shells I'd been using for that rife.

Now a question for you? Your the guy who got me started on this with your talk of would an 80 gr. bullet work in a 1-9", or faster, twist. unless I've missed something you've been awfully quiet since then. How about filling us in on what you've been doing?

Pete

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tturner53 posted this 04 June 2015

So far so good. Thanks for sharing this. I am always interested in range reports. Any idea of the velocities? I'll bet that gun is a .5 MOA shooter with good jacketed ammo. Do you believe it will shoot cast bullets that well?

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PETE posted this 04 June 2015

tturner53,,

Hard telling if the gun will shoot better than it does now. With the best group being the last I'll have to take it up the ladder some more. No doubt 1/2” groups will show now and then but I don' think it will as the norm. Don't forget this a 1st run and it might never do as well ever again.

Have never shot jacketed in the gun. But co!!mparing Apples to Oranges a 60 gr. SAECO bullet I have shows 2010 fps with 11.6 gr. of 4198.

Pete

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Mike H posted this 05 June 2015

Very good Pete,keep going.Mike.

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John Alexander posted this 05 June 2015

Pete wrote: "Now a question for you? Your the guy who got me started on this with your talk of would an 80 gr. bullet work in a 1-9", or faster, twist. unless I've missed something you've been awfully quiet since then. How about filling us in on what you've been doing?"

Pete,   Thanks for the information.  I could read the group size and powder weight on the targets but the other information is appreciated.    Yes, I have been shooting 85 and 75-grain bullets spitzer bullets for over a dozen years, mostly from molds by David Mos.  I should dig out exactly when I sent David the original sketch for the bullet. Time flies when you are having fun and the older you get the faster it goes so maybe it has been longer than that.      For the last couple of years I have spending most of my time shooting NOE 22780 SP a design that Al Nelson agreed to make and list in his catalog. It is a slight modification of the 85-grain Mos bullet which I hoped would be an improvement.  That is yet to be seen but I shot the NOE bullet in the last CBA nationals so at that time I thought it was an improvement.  We will see.

 I have used the Mos bullets in four different Savage M-12s all with one in nine inch twist. Very slow loads tipped a little at 200 yards but not at 100. The Tikka I am now shooting has a 1 in 8 twist.     I have used these bullets in matches since 2001 at velocities from 1,300 to 1,900 fps with mixed results but usually at least in the middle of the pack of 30 caliber shooters. Recently I have been concentrating on loads at the lower end of that range with the NOE 22789 SP bullet. Loads are 4.5 to 7 grains of fast powders 700X, TiteGroup, Blue Dot, etc. There are at least a few other shooters  having some success with the same bullet in 1 in 9 inch twists.     I am surprised that you think I have been quiet since my 70 ”€œ 85 grain 22 bullet designs from molds by Mos, and NOE have been featured in several recent Fouling Shot articles.    If there is other information you are interested in please let me know.    John

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PETE posted this 05 June 2015

john,

Guess I'm not paying attention when you mentioned having a few articles in TFS. Maybe they weren't strung together in consecutive issues. I recall reading some.

I mentioned on here getting the NOE bullet you mention but my mold was pretty much a disaster. No matter what I tried if the melt was the right temp., or hotter, the bullets showed fins around the nose. If I lowered the temp. they wouldn't fill out. Different alloys did the same. After giving up on the project for a while I remembered I had that LBT mold I got for an AR. Looks like it might work.

Want to take the powder charge up till accuracy falls off, then chronograph it and start shooting at 200 yds. and see what it'll do.

The funny thing about the LBT mold is that even being 5 grs. heavier than the NOE 80 gr. it's .030” shorter.

Pete

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John Alexander posted this 05 June 2015

Sounds like you have a good plan.  I will be interested in what happens.

i wouldn't let a few fins at the nose scare me off.  One of my molds does the same thing.  I just scrape them off with my thumbnail as I push on the gas checks.  I can't see that they hurt accuracy.  I just shot the June 1 postal match with such bullets.  I called one shot out and it was a dozy but the average for 4 5 shot groups was still about 1.1” and a 95 on the score match.  Don't sweat the small stuff.    When I try out a new mold and fins are my biggest complaint I consider myself lucky.

John

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PETE posted this 05 June 2015

John,

You might be right about fins being easy to get rid of and don't seem to hurt accuracy. But then I get to wondering how things would go if the mold cast “good” bullets. To many things you can't do anything about not to eliminate those you can.

Sounds like your doing ok on that Postal. Season bench rest I assume? Will have to keep an eye on how your doing. Thinking about that Postal for next year. Will definitely use the ,223 as the neck can't take the pounding of the bigger bores anymore. Doing the Timed Fire Handgun this year.

Pete

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